another oil pump inquiry
04-18-2011, 05:18 PM
#1
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another oil pump inquiry
ok so im building my l28et and want to replace and up the oil pump while i can. im torn between the meeling m111, stock 82-83 280zxt w/ AT, or something?
ill be running stock turbo for now but will up that later on, bored .040 over with wiesco forged pistons blah blah and eventually an oil cooler but might not have that ready and want to make sure i can run a higher flowing oil pump safely with no cooler yet?? and should i try to find oem 280zxt w/ AT oil pump or the m111 which i think someone said was higher volume and pressure?? thanks i've been looking back and forth and have found mixed results.
ill be running stock turbo for now but will up that later on, bored .040 over with wiesco forged pistons blah blah and eventually an oil cooler but might not have that ready and want to make sure i can run a higher flowing oil pump safely with no cooler yet?? and should i try to find oem 280zxt w/ AT oil pump or the m111 which i think someone said was higher volume and pressure?? thanks i've been looking back and forth and have found mixed results.
04-18-2011, 08:12 PM
#2
The MELLING M111 is just an Autozone pump, probably rebuilt from an OEM core. It has the same flow & volume specs as stock.
The stock turbo AT pump flows fine for a modified L28ET. No need to spend a lot of $$$ on some crazy pump.
The stock turbo AT pump flows fine for a modified L28ET. No need to spend a lot of $$$ on some crazy pump.
04-19-2011, 04:58 PM
#3
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Well I'm doing the whole nine yards bored .040 over, acl bearings, arp everything, Intercooler, megasquirt, 240sx tb, forged weisco pistons, walbro fuel pump, custom fuel rail, bigger injectors... It's a build just going to find a p90 solid lifter head to build on the side to put that on a little later too since I'm stuck with the hydraulic one for now but I want oem quality but better flow cause I will up the turbo a little later too it's been rebuilt so don't want it to go to waste. And I'll be running an oil cooler
04-19-2011, 08:17 PM
#4
Yep... the stock turbo oil pump will keep up. 
Almost everything you just mentioned, I've done on my setup (minus the forged pistons... which doesn't affect oil pressure, and MSnS), plus a T3/T4 hybrid turbocharger. I've never had oil pressure problems and I when I drive my car, I often run it to 5500 rpm with 12psi boost.
Almost everything you just mentioned, I've done on my setup (minus the forged pistons... which doesn't affect oil pressure, and MSnS), plus a T3/T4 hybrid turbocharger. I've never had oil pressure problems and I when I drive my car, I often run it to 5500 rpm with 12psi boost.
04-19-2011, 09:24 PM
#5
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Location: Victoria, BC
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I'm going to have to disagree with you on this one. MOST of the oil pumps are the Nissan oil pumps with the 35mm drive assembly for the NA and 40mm for the turbo. The Melling 111 is the only one I know of that is the 45mm driver. This is the performance oil pump of choice and Jeff P is running it in his 600HP 280ZX..... good enough for my build.
04-19-2011, 09:42 PM
#6
(Maybe I read this wrong?)
http://forums.hybridz.org/index.php/...pump-worth-it/
Originally Posted by JeffP
I went through the whole process of the Nissan pumps. First off the turbo pumps I have found from every company is the same stock Nissan unit.
The only other pump available is the millings pump. The turbo pump number is M111 it has the 45mm drive assembly, instead of the standard 40mm drive assembly. In fact this is what the difference between the turbo pump and the standard pump. The LD engine has an even smaller drive assembly as I understand it, but I have not disassembled one to make sure.
The only other pump available is the millings pump. The turbo pump number is M111 it has the 45mm drive assembly, instead of the standard 40mm drive assembly. In fact this is what the difference between the turbo pump and the standard pump. The LD engine has an even smaller drive assembly as I understand it, but I have not disassembled one to make sure.
http://www.zcar.com/70-83_tech_discu..._665625.0.html
Originally Posted by WangsMan
I called Melling (oil pump manufacturer) and talked to the tech guy and he gave me the flow numbers for their datsun pumps.
non turbo L28 (75 to 83)
model M90 = 2 gallons/minute at 491 rpm
turbo L28 with automatic trans
model M111 = 2 gallons/minute at 491 rpm
turbo L28 with manual trans
model M152 = 2.25 gallons/minute at 491 rpm
Since the dist/oil pump. spins half the speed of the crank, 491 oil pump rpm would be 982 engine rpm.
non turbo L28 (75 to 83)
model M90 = 2 gallons/minute at 491 rpm
turbo L28 with automatic trans
model M111 = 2 gallons/minute at 491 rpm
turbo L28 with manual trans
model M152 = 2.25 gallons/minute at 491 rpm
Since the dist/oil pump. spins half the speed of the crank, 491 oil pump rpm would be 982 engine rpm.
04-19-2011, 10:57 PM
#7
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According to Jeff P (I didn't find anything on his site, just on HBZ), the "standard" (n/a?) pump is 40mm & the turbo is 45mm:
(Maybe I read this wrong?)
http://forums.hybridz.org/index.php/...pump-worth-it/
Also... apparently the M152 outflows the M111 in volume:
http://www.zcar.com/70-83_tech_discu..._665625.0.html
(Maybe I read this wrong?)
http://forums.hybridz.org/index.php/...pump-worth-it/
Also... apparently the M152 outflows the M111 in volume:
http://www.zcar.com/70-83_tech_discu..._665625.0.html
http://forums.hybridz.org/index.php/...ost__p__843819
....and while this is V8 stuff the theory is the same. It points out that the size of the driver is critical for flow. It seems odd to me that the M90 and M111 would have the same flow specs yet different sized drivers....
Last edited by FricFrac; 04-19-2011 at 10:59 PM.
04-19-2011, 11:22 PM
#8
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...and another little intersting piece of info....
Part Title Part No Description
34 2.8L (2753CC) L28E,L28ET OHC ENG - 1975-83 - 6 Cyl. - 86.0 MM Bore (1975-78 280Z L28E)
(1979-80 280ZX L28E) (1981-83 280ZX L28ET)
Oil Pump
M-90 1979-1983 280ZX EXC. TURBO
M111 1981-1983 280ZX TURBO W/A.T.
M152 1981-1983 280ZX TURBO W/M.T.
The interesting part is that the AT should have the highest requirement for oil flow as it has the oil cooler whereas the MT doesn't and yet they (from the Melling catalog) recomend the M111 for the most demanding application (AT).....
Part Title Part No Description
34 2.8L (2753CC) L28E,L28ET OHC ENG - 1975-83 - 6 Cyl. - 86.0 MM Bore (1975-78 280Z L28E)
(1979-80 280ZX L28E) (1981-83 280ZX L28ET)
Oil Pump
M-90 1979-1983 280ZX EXC. TURBO
M111 1981-1983 280ZX TURBO W/A.T.
M152 1981-1983 280ZX TURBO W/M.T.
The interesting part is that the AT should have the highest requirement for oil flow as it has the oil cooler whereas the MT doesn't and yet they (from the Melling catalog) recomend the M111 for the most demanding application (AT).....
04-20-2011, 09:10 AM
#10
Intrawebz Wizard
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Vernal, UT
Posts: 3,176
Make me wonder what oil pump is on my Z... I told the machinist to put on a turbo oil pump and this one is cast iron.
And at Idle I get 80PSI when cold, 40PSI when hot! Methinks my sensor is broken lol
And at Idle I get 80PSI when cold, 40PSI when hot! Methinks my sensor is broken lol
04-20-2011, 10:15 PM
#13
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Location: Victoria, BC
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I say the M111. You have two choices. One - just believe me or Two - read the links I posted and whatever else you can dig up on the various sites and make your own decision....
The thing I'd be most interested in now that I've done my research is regarding the M152. I'd call Melling and see if they tell you the same story about the M90 and M111 having the same flow when one has the 40mm and the other is 45mm driver then ask about the M152 and why it's listed for the lesser MT turbo... that would be interesting to know and might shead some more light on the subject.
The thing I'd be most interested in now that I've done my research is regarding the M152. I'd call Melling and see if they tell you the same story about the M90 and M111 having the same flow when one has the 40mm and the other is 45mm driver then ask about the M152 and why it's listed for the lesser MT turbo... that would be interesting to know and might shead some more light on the subject.
Last edited by FricFrac; 04-20-2011 at 10:17 PM.
02-13-2013, 11:37 AM
#15
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Location: Victoria, BC
Posts: 2,195
Just thought I would add some info to this thread for future reference from a post on classiczcars:
"I read hours of internet stuff on oil pumps and never got the yes or no I wanted. A lot of people say M111 is the one to have for more oil pressure. I e-mailed a service tech at Melling and his reply to the difference in M111 & M152 was "The pumps use the same gerotor sets @1.570 thickness.
They use different bypass springs.
The M152 has a slightly higher bypass pressure."
"I read hours of internet stuff on oil pumps and never got the yes or no I wanted. A lot of people say M111 is the one to have for more oil pressure. I e-mailed a service tech at Melling and his reply to the difference in M111 & M152 was "The pumps use the same gerotor sets @1.570 thickness.
They use different bypass springs.
The M152 has a slightly higher bypass pressure."
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