duowing

Ok, so I swapped the CHTS from my N/A to my Turbo. I get up this morning and go to work. I start the car and for some reason the idle is at a rock steady 1500 RPM, but the car goes down the street really well maybe very slight popping through the exhaust. Anyway I get it to work, car's running really well. I turn it off go to work come back. Car's driving OK, not as good as this morning, but pretty good. 2 minutes later if that I stop and get gas, about $20 worth of regular unleaded. Now the car is running horribly. It seems like it wants to die and barely goes. Car will not rev passed 2500 RPM. Once in a while I will get it over that but for a second before the car wants to die. Checked timing without TPS plugged in. Timing is dead on. Plug the TPS and the idle barely changes. So I'm wondering if the TPS or the Fuel Filter might have something to do with it? Any help or ideas are greatly appreciated. Car is currently over at my work's parking lot.

NismoPick

Do you have an A/F gauge hooked up? Is it running rich or lean when it's crapping out? It sounds like a fuel delivery problem, caused by injectors, or AFM.

FubarI33t

maby she just don't like reg gas

WildmaN

What kind of fuel are you getting? The gas station you fill up at? I always use Chevron low grade with the techron in it. (comes with it) And my Z runs pretty clean. If you are using AM PM or Shell, those are pretty much the worst gas you can put it your tank. (especially for an old car)

duowing

I filled up at Shell. Oddly enough. I usually go to BP, it could be the gas. After messing around with it, it seems like I should just go the route of a new AFM. We were messing around with it, and a mechanic we know was messing around with the AFM and at times like it would be fine then other times it would be weird. We got a fuel pressure gauge. At idle the fuel pressure was like 28psi, and Haynes says it should be 30 psi, but at full throttle the gauge was reading dead on at 37 psi. Fuel filter was fine, so it's either injectors or AFM is my guess.

duowing

Ok I'm looking on Rock Auto and they have 2 types of AFM for my car. They have the Beck/Arnley remmaned and the Standard Motor Products. There's about a $110 difference in the prices. I want to know what you guys recommend doing before I spend so much on an AFM.

In other news: HOLY CRAP!
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/dasun...spagenameZWD1V

jfairladyz

The only difference in those parts is that the B&A carries that name. Of course I couldn't attest for the build quality of either of those AFM's cause I've never purchased either brand nor have I been face to face with one. That aside, they're both just AFM's. Just from different companies.

duowing

Thanks for the Info. I went ahead and ordered the Standard Motor Products one. I've been putting off getting ahold of a good AFM. Plus I know if it doesn't work RockAuto is good about exchanging it. I'll see if that works, I think I might pull my injectors and make sure they're all firing. Is it possible for the injectors to work randomly like that though? Run perfectly in the morning, really crappy later, then work a little better, then back to normal, then back to crappy?

jfairladyz

if when they work and when they dont seems to happen during pretty much the same circumstances (ie, work every morning, but then dont work every afternoont) then it's not likely to be the injectors themselves. If it's a completely random accurance then I'd say its possible. If it seems to be temperature related then I'd look toward something in that department: air regulator, CHTS, and/or ATS. I believe you said you've already tried the first two, and with your AFM you'll have replaced the ATS.

duowing

Ok I got my remanned AFM. Now I don't know how the hell I get it into the car. The side with the air temp sensor doesn't have the tubing on it to connect it to the hose. It looks like I have to physically remove the part from one of my other AFMs and screw it on to the reman. Now the problem is, I cannot loosen the screws on the other AFM.

snwbrderphat540

shell is bad? since when? oh ive been living a lie.

jfairladyz

Well I guess that explains the difference in price. The B&A was probably a complete unit. You'll probabaly need an impact driver to get those screws loose. If you dont have access then take it down to a shop and they'll probably break em loose for a few bucks or even free.

duowing

well, we got the new afm in the car. It ran really good, but I went out this morning and it was back to crappy. So I'm thinking I'm gonna pull the injectors and see if I can find something there. In the chance I buy new injectors, any recommendations with prices?

jfairladyz

If they're not leaking then have them serviced. It's a lot cheaper then buying new ones and in most cases will restore them to like new performance.

RodMoyes

Trying to follow this thread is like an A.D.D. kid trying to watch a National Geographic documentary...


Rod.

duowing

Well here's what has happened so far. The car would run decent after warm up, but would run pretty crappy until warm. I took the CHTS out of my N/A Z and swapped it into my Turbo Z. The next morning the car ran really good from a cold start. The car sat for about 8 hours while I worked. After worked I went and filled up and the car was running really crappy. We checked fuel pressure and got idle pressure at 28psi and WOT pressure at 37, so pretty much dead on. I went ahead and got a remanned AFM, we put that in the car and the car ran pretty well. It still had its miss at 2000 RPM. Drove it out to a friend's house, car sat for about 2 hours. Started up fine. Drove it home, next morning car starts up, but is acting like it did that one day after work.

So I figure I'll pull the injectors, check the seals, and see if they're all firing correctly. Can someone give me a good way to see if they're all spraying correctly? I don't know what else to check other than this.

jfairladyz

You can pull the rail and put it over a bucket or tub and activate the injectors to check flow pattern. I've got a thread on here on making a ghetto injector cleaner. It works though. All you need is a few misc. items, a FULLY CHARGED battery, and a couple bottles of injector cleaner mixed in your gasoline.

It's important that your battery be fully charged in order to put enough pressure through the injectors. Running a length of fuel line from the fuel filter to the fuel rail will allow you to utilize the fuel pump thats on the car (I used a spare) and still perform the operation outside of the engine bay.

My turbo engine would hardly run before I did this. I tried running injector cleaner through the fuel system but the pressure regulator wasnt allowing enough pressure to flow through the injectors to really clean them up. I'd advise doing one injector at a time to make sure each injector gets full pressure. The whole operation only takes a few minutes once it's set up.

duowing

How do I use the pump on the car, and recirculate the cleaner enough to clean the injectors out? Basically I just plug the return line, and hook the injectors to the wiring harness on the car, and pour some injector cleaner in the tank, then just crank the car?

By the way, rail is out of the car. Seals look fine. Messing with the car before I pulled the injectors there's no sign of them leaking. So my guess has to be somewhere along the lines of them just not spraying.

jfairladyz

For using the pump in the car try disabling the starter and turning the ignition to 'START' to activate the fuel pump. Thats really the only way I can think of since the pump would otherwise shut off after a few seconds in the 'ON' position. You dont want the engine cranking though cause thats gonna suck juice from the battery.

For wiring up the injectors I used a spare injector wire connector and wired one lead to go to the + battery terminal. I then wired up the other lead to the - battery terminal but with a toggle switch inline to turn the circuit on/off. The difference in my setup and the one above is I had a seperate fuel pump and a bucket of fuel. I wired the fuel pump up with the same toggle switch as the injector connector so it all turned on at the same time.

Here's the diagram:
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c2...eanerbench.jpg
Thats different from how I ended up setting it up in that I only wired one injector at a time instead of all 6 as I illustrated in the diagram.

duowing

Would a non-turbo car's pump work? I'm thinking of maybe pulling the pump from my N/A.

For disabling the starter, I'd still need to hook up the injector directly to the battery, right? Since the ecu controls the injectors they wouldn't fire, or would they?

jfairladyz

an NA pump would work fine. Thats what I used and is why I had it laying around. It was the pump I pulled off my car when I did the turbo swap. It's just gotta put adequate pressure behind the injectors. And yes, you still need to wire the injectors to a direct power source. The ECU will pulse the injectors. You want a constant on for a few seconds at a time. If you're going to go with the spare pump then the whole operation can take place independant of the car itself (which is how I did mine).

duowing

Now this is going to make me sound like a noob, but where is the starter motor. I've never had to mess with it, so I'm not sure as to where it is. Or at least the wire to disable the starter motor?

nismo619

rebuild fuel injectors? eazy ! i know how takes a little bit of time thou. " u will need new " PINTAL " Caps New FUEL INJECTOR SCREENS and new fuel injecting hose about 3 feet of it. I used Good year hig pressure Fuel hose . Cut old fuel hose off with dremel to make it go in a hurry but off 3 inch peaces of the fuel hose for each injector ... i should make me a stickey...

NismoPick

Starter motor is located at the right rear of the block (attached to the tranny bell housing). Trace the + battery cable & wa-la! This is what it should look like:



That's not "REBUILDING" a fuel injector tho... You need to pull the injector apart to rebuild it. So you'd see the internals like thus:

duowing

Ok, so I got the pump out of my non-turbo. We got hoses, wire, and pulled the battery. I made my injector connector, and hooked it all up. So injector 1 started out as like a shower, then slowly turned into a normalized stream. After we were done all 6 injectors had a straight stream coming from them. Is this correct or should there be breaks in the stream? As we did it some of them didn't have a straight stream, but would eventually even out into that. Once we did all 6, we went back through and they were all the same staright stream. I'd assume this is correct? The tub of injector cleaner at the end was really pretty dirty.