kevtt

I want to upgrade my brakes rotors and have a couple of choices:

http://www.czp.us/Cart/description.p...45216.9.43.250

or

http://www.autopartswarehouse.com/pe...8&brandid=1929

any of you guys have experienced with one or another??

b300z

those are two pretty different self explanatory choices. theyre both good companies. i would go with coz'z just so i could get the other stuff at a good price. plus coz is a great guy to deal with

CanyonCarver

Go with the Brembos.

silvrhand

Neither of these will directly "improve" your stopping distance, they'll improve brake fade but you have to have a larger rotor/surface area to improve braking distance typically.

If you are still on stock rims you don't have much of a choice on things that fit.

ZLover4Life

2nd, but with one provision... they're not even going to noticably improve brake fade.

Considering they're inexpensive rotor options (trust me, by comparison to the high performance directional vein cross-drilled/slotted rotors, they're cheap), I'm 99% sure that they're not spiralled/directional veins. Cross-drilled rotors with non-spiralled veins are only drilled for show, because without the spiral in the veins, they're not going to draw any heat away from the pads and rotor surface. Between the two, I'd go with Coz's package, but the rotors aren't going to increase performance any more than new blank rotors will.

Additionally, any company who says that our front rotors are 11" (your "auto parts warehouse" link) should be avoided. The rear rotors are 11" while the fronts are 10.8" (yes, the rears are larger to help balance out braking).

In reality, there's a cheaper and better option to upgrading your stock brakes. Here it is...

1. Hawk HPS pads are generally accepted as the best street pads (Metal Master pads offered with Coz's package suck compared to other options). $72 for the front (don't worry about the rears, they'll make no noticable difference... replace those when your stock pads actually go bad).

2. Technafit Teflon Coated Braided Stainless Steel Brake Lines (SPLParts.com) $84

3. 300Degree Brake Master Cylinder Brace. $35

4. ATE Fluid x 2. $36

That's $227 and I give you my personal guarantee it'll stop better than Coz's $460 package.

However, if you need rotors because yours are going bad, get SPLParts.com's "stock brake upgrade kit" which includes everything I just mentioned with Brembo blank rotors for $460. Considering you're getting better pads AND the brake master cylinder brace for the same price, I feel it's a MUCH better option.

silvrhand

Unfortunately Metal Masters were the only thing when I did my upgrade, they never dust though so I do love that but man they take some warming up but after that they bite pretty good.

Do you really feel the master cylinder brace actually works worthwhile? I am kind of skeptical about it.

CanyonCarver

No doubt that the BBK's are THE brake performance upgrade. If you're looking for some stock type replacement rotorz, I'd recommend the Brembos (blanks, drilled, slotted, or drilled and slotted) over any of the raybestos brand type of crap. I've seen the EBC brand and for all you know it's re-labeled crap.

Key point being that my Brembo brand of rotorz haven't shown any signs of warpage, hard spots, soft spots, or significant wear after almost two years of abuse.

ZLover4Life

I'm kind of in the same boat. When I needed mine, I was working at Ultimate Z and we only had Stillen Metal Matrix in stock, so I went with that thinking there couldn't be that much of a difference. However, after doing lots of research on brakes (which I will be doing lots of work to next spring, if all goes according to plan), I realized that EVERYONE who tracks their car uses Hawk, so that's what I'll be going with next.

The way I look at this is simple... it can't hurt, especially for only $35.

I have it installed on my car and I did notice that the pedal felt more... let me think of the best word for it... constant, I guess. When I say constant, I mean there was less deviation in the amount of pedal pressure needed between when I was doing harder braking and when I was doing normal braking. HOWEVER, it is important to note that I have not done ANY really heavy braking since I've installed it (I don't drive the Z hard much anymore), so the fact that I haven't noticed a huge difference is rooted purely in normal street driving. Once I actually start tracking the car again, I'll be able to make a better judgement.

Considering I know several reputable Z owners who stand by it, and it's been proven that the firewall does flex under heavy braking (which is what the BMC Brace prevents, thus allowing more pedal pressure to be eminated through the master cylinder and into your actual braking), I have no regrets about dishing out the money for it.

After all, you know the Z community (namely TT.NET) and vendors... if there was a product that was a scam, it'd be eliminated REAL quick. 300Degree tends to know what they're doing with parts though.

silvrhand

My problem with the product is that you are now using the master cylinder as a brace for the firewall, instead of pulling the master cylinder and trying to brace the firewall itself and then remounting the master cylinder.

Now the force is transferred onto the master cylinder and then to the bolt, which doesn't seem like a good idea or really a good way to stop that kind of force. Maybe the side structure braces from SPL would stop the real problem?

ZLover4Life

Why's that a problem? We're talking about eliminating no more than 3/8 of an inch of master cylinder movement... what are the alternatives? Adding a bunch of metal to the firewall? That adds weight and probably wouldn't eliminate all the movement unless you added a LOT of metal. Bracing directly against the firewall? The brace would have to be larger and thicker to accomplish this, or it would bend due to a lack of structural rigidity. The master cylinder is sturdy enough to be able to handle the task... there's no way it's going to cause any problems.

And in reality, when you want something to stop flexing, you brace it directly. The firewall flexing is a result of pressure on the brake pedal being transferred through the firewall into the brake master cylinder. So you're not so much trying to stop the firewall from flexing (who cares if it does? that directly doesn't hurt anything), as you're trying to stop the brake master cylinder from moving 3/8" forward, thus resulting in less pedal pressure being sent into your brakes. To stop the master cylinder from moving, brace the master cylinder... simple as that.

(Don't think of it as stopping the firewall from moving, think of it as stopping the brake master cylinder from moving. This is what will improve pedal feel.)

If you're referring to the front fender brace (which is the only one I think you could be referring to), it would do nothing. The front fender brace is to prevent strut tower flex... it would help very little with brake master cylinder movement.

silvrhand

I could be totally wrong here: <-- should have been in my first reply FYI.

I just don't see the master cylinder causing the firewall to flex, I would think it would be more strain caused by something else under heavy braking flexing the firewall. I would love to see a video of the firewall flexing just to see it in action, just seems gimmicky to me, like I said I could be totally wrong but this is just one of those products that I would have to see to believe. I would think the strut tower brace, and the front fender brace would stiffen up the front end and mid section of the car quite a bit and stop any firewall flexing if it was from the front end twisting a bit under heavy breaking.

I would think someone would have to pound the hell out of the brakes like they were putting their foot through the floor to actually flex the firewall.. I dunno I could be way off.

CanyonCarver

It's been noted numerous times in numerous posts on a couple of forums about the positive effect of a master cylinder brace. People swear by the firmer brake pedal feel. I don't even have one myself.... yet. I'll be getting one in a coupla weeks when someone contributes one to me for helping them install new rotors, pads, lines and brace.

If you want to visualize the need for one, just have someone step on and off the brake pedal (like when bleeding) and watch the master cylinder move under the hood.

I imagine a better design of brace than the braces I see on the market. The current braces prevent fore and aft movement of the cylinder, while the actual movement of the cylinder appears to be in more of an arc.

I feel sometimes that I'm driving so hard (or tense) that I'm also flexing the firewall with my left foot on that little foot rest.

ZLover4Life

Sorry, but yeah, you kinda are. The pedal pressure that a driver (while driving aggressively) puts on the firewall is pretty significant. The better brake feel comes from stopping the master cylinder from moving forward, that's the only purpose of the brake master cylinder brace. That's why it's not called a "firewall brace," because it's not necessarily meant to stiffen up the firewall, but to brace the master cylinder.

You are right about a strut bar and a fender brace doing more for chassis rigidity, but that's entirely not what the master cylinder brace is for... it's purely to give a more direct braking feel (same concept as braided brake lines, really... except instead of stopping brake lines from expanding, thus reducing pressure, you're stopping the master cylinder from reducing some of the pedal pressure by moving away from the pedal).

As CanyonCarver said, you can usually see the master cylinder moving if you step on the brakes hard enough. It'll likely even move a little more when the firewall is heated up a bit by the engine and you're constantly applying heavy brake pressure while entering turns.

silvrhand

Cool point taken, just didn't seem right but maybe so Nothing wrong with being wrong.

Goofyz

all those things people mentioned before work for feel and fade, but except for perfectly flat fresh roads, you really wont notice too much of a gain in overal brake performance. Sure with the right pads SS lines and such you will probably stop 3-5 feet quicker from 60mph. But you are still working with stock ABS actuators and everything else will remain the same... Here is what you do to stop quicker. Put in racing seats, remove your sterio and all its components, remove the spare tire, remove the interior, put in a 1 peice driveshaft, remove HICAS if you have it. Put in a smaller battery, etc, etc. Basicly, if you don't change this one thing (ill mention in a second) your braking wont be affected as much as if you lose 300-400 pounds off the weight of your car.

PUT ON BIGGER STICKIER TIRES, the more contact you have on the road the faster you will stop. Its that simple. Everything else augments that.

Riz Z Speed

just to throw in my .02.

I found the Stillen brake pads to dust a lot and quickly. I now use the EBC Greenstuff and dust is virtually non existant.