|
lets talk sencors
what sencors will shut off a 280zx during warm up ......
the problem ................ every time i start my zx IN THE MORING ..it will starts fine but when i get to just about the F on the temp she sputters and dies ..........If iam on the gas it will miss fire a few times then die .....after she dies she will crank over and over and wont start the tach wont move at all during this time ......if i dont turn it over and just wait it out.... she will fire back UP right away and WILL run fine for the rest of the day ....IT ONLY DOES THIS ON THE FRIST FULL WARM UP...it only does this one time a day everyday ... :confused: :confused: AFTER IT DOES THIS IT WONT DO IT AGAIN UNTELL THE NEXT MORING WARM UP |
This is the exact symptom when my dizzy stator and rotor went out..The thermo would open up and get the dizzy hot the everthing would expand to far away to make a spark.. But it happened everytime it went above F not just the first warm up...
|
i swaped in a diff dissy not to long ago IT did this befor then..ONLY FRIST WARM UP..SO I THOUGHT "IT" WAS THE IM .SO I swaped THREE IM'S in and out and it still did it ..one time IT did IT and i swaped ECU's ..SHE STILL WOULDNT START INTELL I WAITED A BIT :( i swapped in that ecu befor SO I KNOW THAT IT WOULD start my car fine..BUT DURING THE TIME in ? IT DIDn't START sher AT ALL :( THIS IS SUCH A PAIN IN THE ASS TO FIGURE OUT ......I WISH I WOULD HAVE STAYED THE NIGHT AT MEETING OF THE MINDS SO BLEACH COULD HAVE SEEN IT DO THIS FRIST HAND :(
it only does "IT" "THIS" OR "WHAT EVER YOU WANT TO CALL IT" IN ON FRIST FULL WARM UP ..... TO MARROW IN THE MORING I WILL SWAP ALT'S AND SEE "IT" GOES BYE BYe i dont know what eles to do |
Could be your Cylinder Head Temp. Sensor. As far as why it only does it the first time around, beats me. But that sounds like something that would happen with a bad CHTS. I had the same problem s/c was talking about, sort of. It didn't happen at such a low temp, but once the car got pretty close to op. temp. it would start sputtering and missing. I changed out the stator and reluctor because I couldn't get it gapped right and that problem went away. It was really wierd cause it only happened every once in a while, but ever since I changed them, no more missing problems. Of course I've been trough the whole bad IM, wobbly dist. and whatever else could go wrong with the ignition. Even had a coil crack on me!?!
|
yea, It sounds to me like a coil issue...took me a few hours to diagnose my frontier when it had a bad coil and similar symptoms...had to replace the whole Distributor, sucks. When it dies next time, pull one ignition wire at a time and hold it to ground, see if its got spark...easy way to test for coil.
|
i have a new coil ...........just to update "it" did "it" yesturday moring and this moring just like "it" always does ...i have found that if i wait and just let her sit for five to ten min's then she fires right back up frist try :confused: :confused: :confused:
this moring as i was testing her ...as i do every moring...I heard her sputter ....so i pulled off into a parking lot... she died right there JUST as i got her stoped ....i turned her off ,waited five min's and she fired right up .....i just dont understand why it will only do it one time and only on frist full warm up.... i DONT get it ......IF i HAD turned the key and not waited ..i would have been waiting alot longer..... if i turn the key during this time ....she will just turn over and over with no tach movement ...if i wait but i dont wait long eff the tach will jump just alittle as i turn the key but then not move at all ......i have tryed this so many times that i know what it does when it does it .......i just dont know WHY:( it seems like that went it sputters .....the ecu is looking for something ...its like a little miss fire ...then it runs smooth again ...if i rev it it goes right away ...but then all of a sudden it just cuts out tach drops .keep in mind that this car runs awsome any other time but this one time a day ....all the lights are still there everything works fine during this time ... but if i turn the key durning this time i get no tach movement and she will turn over and over but wont start ......IF I WAIT ....five to ten mins later she fires right up like there was nothing wrong ...she never does it again untell the next moring :confused: :confused: :confused: I WISH THERE WAS A METER THAT I COULD PUT ON IT DURING THE TIME IN ? TO SEE IF ALL THE SENCORS ARE WORKING RIGHT OR IF ONE THAT IS NOT READING RIGHT DURING THIS TIME :confused: :confused: :confused: |
i spent all day looking for a Voltmeter........i didnt have any luck :( yes J it does it in the eveing if i dont starting all day .........it did it yesturday and today ...i have found that if i drive to the place iam going and sit there intell it does it .....then i turn it off and go inside ...when i come out it starts right up .it will not do this at all after that NOT untell the next moring warm up ......i will pm you as soon as i fined a Voltmeter....your tail light will be in the mail tomarrow moring when the post office opens up.......i wish i could fig this out ITS DRIVING ME NUTS :D
|
TODAY IT DID IT two times and the second time it did it took a long time to start :( i switch IM's DRUING THIS TIME AND IT DID NOT FIX THE PROBLEM ......
I THINK IT MITE BE MY COIL ......NEXT TIME IT DOES THIS IAM GOING TO SWITCH BACK TO MY STOCK ONE AND SEE IF IT FIXES IT ....MABE THIS COIL IS FAULTY ... DURING WARM UP I HEAR A NOSE COMEING FROM THE FRONT OF MY MOTOR .... IT SOUNDS LIKE MY TIMEING CAIN IS GOING OUT ...IT WAS A CLICKING AND IT MADE MY LOWER FRONT PULLY SHAKE .....AFTER IT GOT WARM IT WENT AWAY ...IT THINK THAT MEANS IT'S TIME TO CAHNGE THE TIMEING CAIN .....I HOPE IT'S NOT A CRANK BEARING ...I THINK MY TIMEING CAIN MORE THOUGH ...IF IT WAS A MAIN BREAING I WOULD HEAR IT WOSE WHEN REVED ...WITCH I DONT ALSO I DONT THINK IT WOULD GO AWAY AFTER IT WARMED UP ........THE TIMEING CAIN BEING STRATCHED COULD DO THIS THOUGH .....I THINK .....ANYONE HAVE ANY THOUGHTS ON THIS |
That's most likely a completely unrelated problem if it is actually what you think you're hearing.
You'll need to make it a two man job or make up a remote starter button so you can be 'beside' the engine bay (please don't stand in front of your car with a remote starter button!) and kick it over while it's having the problem. This way you can more accurately identify where the sounds are coming from and isolate each problem. You can get a Digital Volt Meter from Home Depot for $10 to $15. Get one that looks like this: http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/w...=12496&R=12496 |
ok i will go get one as soon as i have some money today or tomarrow .....
as for the sound iam going to go listen for it this moring ...... |
no sounds and no cut out this moring ....i took her to full warm up and it do not do it ....i heard it flutter alittle but it got right though it ....i started her and stoped her a bunch and still nothing ....i think it just fluttered pasted it i dont know iam going to go out and mess with her some more after a bit ........if i does it iam going to switch coils around and see if it goes away ....i dont know ......i will go to napa or a1 and see if i can get a volt checker thingy :D
|
Originally Posted by 81 Black L28E
no sounds and no cut out this moring ....i took her to full warm up and it do not do it ....i heard it flutter alittle but it got right though it ....i started her and stoped her a bunch and still nothing ....i think it just fluttered pasted it i dont know iam going to go out and mess with her some more after a bit ........if i does it iam going to switch coils around and see if it goes away ....i dont know ......i will go to napa or a1 and see if i can get a volt checker thingy :D
|
took her out again and still nothing it at ful warm and is running like a top ....
i scared some old lady with a savage kick .....sick so ........ we need a drifting icon in the icon bar :p |
i dont know nismo ...i dont know :eek:
|
still nothing
|
That's when it gets scary. When it fixes itself and you never knew what was wrong. Then you everytime you go to start it you have to worry about whether it's going to do it or not.
|
hahahahahahha ant that the truth ...j....ant that the truth :eek:
|
right as i went to step on it at a stop light today it shit out .........i pushed it to the side of the road and waited .....she fired right up but then died right away again ...so i let it sit longer and in about five min's it started and ran fine .....this is getting to be very much a pain it the ass :(
|
Better get that meter before you're stuck in a really bad spot :eek:
|
SHIT I HAVE BEEN TRYING I JUST DONT KNOW ANYONE WITH ONE ...i will go and see if the auto parts store has one in the moring ...sorry i didnt send you this stupied tail light ...i have been doing nothing ......god iam a lazy son of a bitch sometimes .......
J i will get it done .......i will put it in the z that way i wont forget it next time i go to the post office :) as soon as i get this meter i will PM you so you can tell me the frist few things to check .... |
It's not like I've been able to afford to drive it into town lately with the prices gas was hitting. So I wasn't really missing the taillight too much. But come Monday she's getting fill up and I'm taking her cruising. Back roads of course. The cops out here are pretty anal and if they see me without a taillight they'll write me up real quick. So I'm gonna stay out of town for a while. Last thing I need is to get pulled over without insurance :D
You should be able to buy a votmeter (doesn't do anything else) for pretty cheap at HomeDepot or Autozone, or something similar to those. The only requirement is that it reads DC voltage. At an autostore this shouldn't be a problem but if you decide to go to home depot or somewhere like that just make sure its not AC only. It should have a switch to read both. In case you don't know: DC is indicated by a straight line over the V. AC is indicated by a squiggly line over the V on the meters. I remember when my Z quit on me on the freeway during traffic. (this is I15 rushhour traffic :D ) and I had my then 1 year old son in the car. That was the last straw and I pulled her off the road until I was absolutely sure I had found the problem. Ended up being the IM on mine. Didn't have that first start up problem but it sure as hell would quit on me and sometimes it wouldn't start for a day or two. Bad time...Bad times. |
Its deffinitely your ignition man, check the voltage getting to your coil (should be 12v), try to get your car in a shop with an Ignition scope. If the voltage going to the coil is right, then its gotta be in the secondary side, wires, plugs, secondary coil in the Ignition Coil. I'm thinking your coil is either overheating (is it an aftermarket one like MSD etc... If so look for a crack in it where the cooling oil might have all leaked out, don't think those OEM coils have Oil in them or not.
I think somehow the primary windings are grounding to the secondary windings (or case) as it gets hotter and expands) therefore its only getting 12 volts to the spark plug instead of 35,000volts. Check voltages all along the ignition system, and if you can get an Ignition scope you can determine exactly the problem. also test your Ignition wires for extra resistance. Are your plugs gapped right, if its too small of a gap (Heat may expand the electrode to ground), there won't be any air for the spark to jump, therefore won't ignite anything. I came across a car with exact symptoms a work a few years ago. |
i have a new coil and new plugs ....if this im doesnt fix it then i will swap back to the old coil .....if that doesnt fix it then i will check all the gaps on my plugs .i just got these plugs two weeks ago..i put them in and gapped them my self so iam pretty sure that i gaped them all right ....i bought this coil new from napa it is a accel super stock coil ...if the new IM doesnt fix the problem then iam pretty sure that its my coil .....thanks for the info ..i will let everyone know how it turns out after i get this new IM friday OR saturday....
|
my car doesnt like to start in the mornings, i hardly got it to start up this morning, and it accelerated jerky. o.0 then at about 8 i went to run an errand and it started and ran fine
|
the crazyies part about this j .....ok let me tell you about this ....some times i stay out at my girls house ...the last two times that i stayed there.... when i drove home in the moring ...it started fine it drove all the way to town and as i got to the main stop light it died ..it did this two time in the same spot ....if i drove out ther and stayed the night tonight and drove back in the moring it would do it at the same spot ....its so wierd how it will only do it in the moring and at the same spot...time..or temp.. ....wierd :eek: hopefully it's the IM and it turns out goldend :p it really isn't that bad.. i only have to wait two mins just that one time every ****ing day stop light full of traffic or not ......i hate it when poeple try to come help me .....that is such a ****ing joke ....i mean its cool of them really cool ...but i bulit this car and if i wanted help form some bumm of the street i would ask .. i hate it i had so many poeple come up and ask if i need a jump ......... :eek: :eek: i just want to yell " hey stupied can you hear it turning over shut the **** up and go get back in your van ,big hick truck or what ever it is that you take to the shop to have fixed and go away".....
anyways i just smile and say no thanks.... but really if one more fool asks me if i need a jump ....i mite just blow my top ....i mean really you can hear it turning over why would any one think it needed to be jumped .....i have made my mind up ....most poeple in this world are COW'S that are scared of there own shadow ...it makes me sick how poeple just live there lifes going with the flow ...they take there cars to shops and know nothing about what there really buying or how to fix it ...they dont want to even try to learn ....its to hard or i cant ....****ING COW'S YOU KNOW WHO YOU ARE.. ONLY YOU CAN DO FOR YOUR SELF ...not the us gov not a check at the first of the month ...i feel bad for all the poeple stuck in this system.... but i was there not all that long ago and you can dig your self out all you have to do is try ..... |
Originally Posted by 81 Black L28E
...most poeple in this world are COW'S that are scared of there own shadow ...it makes me sick how poeple just live there lifes going with the flow ...they take there cars to shops and know nothing about what there really buying or how to fix it ...they dont want to even try to learn ....its to hard or i cant ....****ING COW'S YOU KNOW WHO YOU ARE.. ONLY YOU CAN DO FOR YOUR SELF ...not the us gov not a check at the first of the month ...i feel bad for all the poeple stuck in this system.... but i was there not all that long ago and you can dig your self out all you have to do is try .....
What year did the z's start using the IM's? im gonna look for a TSB on this one. |
i think all of the N/A z's from 79-83 have them i not sure about the years befor
nismo says that the turbo z's dont have them ...ther dizzy's are much diff then the n/a cars |
The 280Z had them too. And you gotta remember that guy that doesn't know a dipstick from a sparkplug could be a whiz kid with a computer. Or would laugh in the face of someone who needed a cabinet made or a garage constructed. Everyone's got their forte, alot of people are just too ignorant to find it. Its the ignorant people that are the cows ;)
|
yesturday i cleaned and gapped all of my spark plugs and set dissy to a mark more advanced ...i also turned the air flow screw just a notch....idle and power came up ...i ajusted my fuel presser ragulator long with ajusting the others and she seemed to run cleaner ... i could always here this little miss fire at idle....i have been try to get it gone for a long time .i could mostly feel this when sitting at a stop light or just as i would step on it to go not full step but just a normal driving speed..well the new IM got here today ......it was brand new shiney new not a mark on it :) i poped it in and it worked better then i thought it would .....idle its perrrrrrrfect and power is way up ...even the stupied little miss fire is gone :eek:
the curve that this IM it set to seems very different from the stock nissan one ... i dont know what Regitar did but really it has a much different power curve... it pulls hard all the way though NO lag off the line ...power from 2200rpm to 5500rpm is a lot more ...seems to me that i wasnt getting all of the spark that i should have been... now when i kick it down it puts me back in the seat :eek: it even sounds better much deeper with a smooth throtty rumble and a screming top end...i had to be carefull not to step on it to much when taking off it burns out now :D .... i still dont know about the shuting off problem... i put it in at about 2:00pm today my car had already been driven and it had already been though the shut off bullshit and then restarted...so i will go though my normal warm up in the moring and see if it does it or not ....hopefully it wont do it ..it didnt do it at all this after noon or this eveing :) as for buying this item he offers a Warranty Products are warranted for a period of 3 months, from the date of purchase. We will replace without charge (excluding shipping charges) any product found to be defective in material or workmanship when returned with proof of purchase by the original purchaser im stoked on this product if you own a 79 to 81 n/a 280zx i would call the # and order one of these right away the price alone is worth it... i mite order one more just to have a extra :D |
Glad to hear your Z is runnung better! :) Hopefully in the morning she starts right up for you. Too bad I have a '82, it has an extra plug on the IM. The '79-'81's won't work on mine. Argghh! :p
|
it shut off right after full warm up :( ..............DAM IT ... coil or head temp sen????
i think iam going to go down and buy a MSD coil today **** accel :) |
Well at least it ran like an animal until it died... Sounds like the coil after all.
Rod. |
WELL I THOUGHT THAT SO I SWAPED COILS WHEN IT DID IT AGAIN THIS MORING :(
IT FIRED RIGHT UP WITH THE STOCK COIL IN ....AND THEN IT SHUT OFF AGAIN :(........SO I HOOKED THE ACCEL ONE BACK UP AND IT FIRED RIGHT OVER ...I TOOK IT ON A HOUR DRIVE TO A SKATE PARK IT THE NEXT TOWN .....I SKATED FOR ABOUT AN HOUR AND I THEN DROVE HOME IT DIDNT DO IT AT ALL ther or on the way BACK.. .....I THINK BEFOR I GO BY A COIL IAM GOING TO GO AND BUY A HEAT TEMP SEN.............. s/c TELL YOU ME ABOUT dizzy stator and rotor STUFF how do i change the stator THIS SHITYYYYYYY POST WILL GO ON UNTELL I FIG THIS OUT :mad: :mad: |
Hey Black, When it dies, have you checked to see if it's cranking and just not getting spark? I mean have you actually checked for spark when it's failing to restart? I know it sounds crazy, but talking about my Porsche reminded me about when I had a nifty little intermittant problem with my fuel pump on it. It did the exact same thing you are describing. It would start in the morning and drive until it got hot and just shut off. Wouldn't restart until it wanted to. Chased that problem for weeks until some Augustus Glup sounding Nazi Porsche guru said "Ya, for sure is petrol pump... for sure." Turns out Gerhardt knew what he was talking about.
Rod. |
someone had said this to me befor ....i didnt listen mabe i should now ....ok ok
befor go buying a bunch of shit iam going down to the auto parts store and see if i can get a volt thingy ....i will be back in a few |
1 Attachment(s)
will this do the job :) ok how do i do this ....tell me the frist five steps and when it shuts off again i will go though the steps :)
|
That'll work perfect. I'll PM you. Oh and I'll let you know about the stator and rotor swap too.
|
sounds good J :)
|
Looking for an update here Black, What's the scoop? I was looking through all the posts in the thread, and I'm thinking it's either the Fuel Pump or the Dizzy. Just wondering what the latest find is.
Rod. |
i went to start it this moring and it wouldnt start ............ :confused: :confused: tach jumped around for a min and then has sat still ever sence .....i keep missing with it but reALY ...........iam over it .........i think i mite just be a cow and call a shop :mad:
i have a fuel gau and i can hear the fuel pump switch on so i dont think its fuel i took the coil wire and grounded it and turned it over to see if there was spark but it didnt look like there was any .........????????? iam sick of it ...i just want my car to work so i can go get some smokes . **** it |
Well, If the tach shows no signal, then it isn't the Fuel Pump. I'm gonna lean toward the Dizzy still, but this isn't my best area.
Rod. |
On my '82 my tach doesn't move until a few seconds after I start it. Then it starts working, weird.
|
i think iam the BIGGEST fool in the world .........i pulled # 1 plug and in was dry as a bone ...i set it on the strut tower and turned it over and there was spark .......
iam a fool my fuel pump is gone to shit ...... :eek: |
iam even more of a fool ..........my fuel pump is working fine my injectors are not adding the fuel ......i know this becuse if i pull the Hose to my fuel rail and turn it over fuel pumps out .........so if my injectorS arent opening and closeing then its my ECU????
just to be safe could it be my afm shutING off the fuel flow ????? i read some where that the afm can shut fuel flow off ???????? IT STILL HAS NOT STARTED :( |
The head temp sensor can kill the engine (not damage, I mean shut it off) if it's signal gets outta parameters. It'll cause the engine to run too rich or too lean and just kill it. If you've got spark and you're gettin guel to the injectors then it's got to be fuel or ECU related. Do you have a major Auto Chain near you? If so go down and ask to borrow a noid light. It'll probably run you a deposit but you should get it all back when you return it. Just plug it into the injector harness (pick one, and work your way through them, but I'm guessing none of em are going to work if it's ecu related). If the sucker is flashing really rapid and bright then theres nothing wrong with the ecu (not as far as driving the injectors anyways). If the light does nothing then the ECU is not firing the injectors. Either a bad circuit or it's faulty. If the ECU IS faulty don't toss it. They can USUALLY be repaired. If the injectors are firing and the car still wont start then I'm going to lean toward the head temp. sensor or it's circuit. And since you've got a meter now you can test the head temp sensor to see if the sensor itself is acting up. If the head temp sensor circuit is seeing too much resistance the car won't be able to run, or start. It'll be too rich. I'd suggest going down and getting a noid light tomorrow if you can and PM if you want to know how to test the head temp sensor.
|
Oh and black, I've done a lot of tweaking with the AFM and it's circuits and through out all my tests I could not get the AFM to kill the engine no matter how far off I through the signals. The only sensor I could get to kill the engine was the head temp sensor. It doesn't take much to throw off the head temp sensor signal to the point where it shuts the car off either. If I didn't adjust the signal it wouldn't start back up either. SO if the sensor ain't bad, the connector or the circuit could be.
|
THIS SUCKS ......i know for sure that none of the injectors are firering fuel .....
i went ahead and swaped ECU's I HAVE A extra 79 ecu ...so i swaped it in and it still wont start ....i have tryed this ecu befor so i know it will start my car .....but it still wont start .....what would stop my injectors from fireing also why wont my tach move as i turn it over ..i have been reading though the hayness man and i cant figure it out .... |
Are you sure they're not firing? Maybe the dropping resistor is fried :confused: Could be a bad FI relay. Also, still could be a bad ignition switch circuit not sending power to a relay. That's about all thats left if the injector just plain aren't firing and you're getting spark and you KNOW the ECU is good. It's intermittent so I'm going to stay away from timing. I'd suggest checking and replacing the relays that control the FI. Make sure the computer grounds are all good too. And last but not least, if the cylinder head temp circuit is open it should cause the car to not start or run. I've experimented with that one too. If you've got wiring diagrams then I'd suggest putting that meter to use. If you don't have any diagrams I can email you some to get you started.
|
bad FI relay????????????????? MY CAR WILL RUN WITH OR WITH OUT THE HEAD TEMP SEN PLUGED IN .....I KNOW THIS TO BE A FACT ..IT SOUNDS WIERD BUT IT WORKS WITH OR WITH OUT IT PLUGED IN ...
Maybe the dropping resistor is fried???????????? |
Thats crazy. If I pull mine the car just shuts off. It's an 81 too, just like yours. That's weird. And the ECU is controlled by a relay. If that relay goes the ECU doesn't get powered up. I'm running out of ideas here. It's hard when I can't actually test anything. Try pulling the FI relay and replacing that. Relays can be had for cheap if you or Bleach don't have one laying around. It's a lone relay, I believe it's in the Fender by the battery and fuse link box (someone correct me if Im wrong). It pulls it's power from the fuse links. Which gives me something else. If you've got a failing fuse link maybe it's breaking open and closing depending on how its vibrated. Heat does really strange things to electrical components. But I'd check the FI relay then. Think about a starter solenoid. On my old mustang the solenoid was going out (same thing as a relay). I'd try to start the car and it wouldn't. After a few trys, finally it would start. The problem got worse and worse until finally I couldn't get it to start no matter how much I tried. So I finally replaced the solenoid. Problem was solved. A little bit different of a problem here but the same basic idea. If that relay isn't staying closed or it's power supply circuit isn't staying closed then it's going to cut off power to the ECU which means you're fuel injectors arent going to fire no matter how many ECU's you try putting in there.
|
| All times are GMT -7. The time now is 08:51 AM. |
© 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands