bradyg

alright well i have been reading the sticky Z31 setup w/ SAFC? and was wondering your guys opinion on which is better the megga squirt or the z31. and which is harder to swap because im kinda stuck in between the two on what to use. and id rather go with the one that is the easiest to set up thanks. oh yea and with the mega squirt you dont have to have a lap top in the car the whole time right? you can just do the settings and than take the computer out?

lifegrddude

Hands down the MegaSquirt setup is a better than using the piggyback SAFCII. You can custom make your own fuel and timing maps with MegaSquirt, whereas with the SAFC you're stuck tweaking a preset map and have no way to adjust ignition timing. If you upgrade injectors while using the SAFC, you'll need a MSD BTM to retard the timing under boost, otherwise you'll risk detonation at higher boost pressures. I just wish the retard was adjustable via rpm instead of strictly boost pressure.

The SAFC is easier to "install" on your Z since it only requires splicing into a few wires, but if you want to have ultimate control over your vehicle's fuel and ignition, stepping up to MegaSquirt would be best. Plus the MegaSquirt has datalogging capabilities which are very useful for tuning. I chose to use the SAFC for ease of install, plus I can't pass emissions without a MAF present in the engine bay along with all the other equipment required to reduce emissions. But for as much work as I've put into setting up the SAFC to work on my Z, I'd been better off doing a MegaSquirt installation.

jfairladyz

and NO, you dont need a laptop in the car fulltime. The computer is only for tuning. Once you're set, you don't have to ever hook up a computer again unless you want to make a change.

bradyg

do you guys know any useful threads or stickys on how to install a mega squirt

jfairladyz

go to http://forums.hybridz.org/forumdisplay.php?f=88 It's an entire section of hybridz dedicated to megasquirt.

also:
http://www.megasquirt.info/index.html
http://www.bgsoflex.com/megasquirt.html

within the megasquirt site there is also a link for the megasquirt forum where you can read what others have done and get any answers you need.

EatmyDust

I don't know about all that megaspuirt stuff man its nice for performance, but after a wile, it seems like it would just get old adjusting your car for driving style. yea it is supereor control, but somtimes I just want to drive and let the car do its thing. it also dosn't seem like the thing to use if you are one of those guys, that really isn't all into your car. there is installation, and some thoght to be put into the process. I am not bashing the system, it is nice. I just havn't goten the ***** myself to go back into my car and take all the electrical back out and replace it again, this time to be a system that I am entirly unfomiler with. dosn't seem worth it to me yet. if only there was somthing tangible to check out befor making the conversion.

Skully

It is recommended tho...because you can log everything your engine does on your laptop directly PLUS there is a way to tune WHILE driving...and you can see what your engine does on your laptop....highly recommend it..hell i bought a laptop just for MS...

Skully

some of this is true...it is mostly for extreme tunning purposes...but its also GREAT if you want to replace your stock POS ignition!...also you can save MULTIPLE settings on your laptop..so when you want to drive on a track..click and open "280zx Track", when you are going on a trip click and open "280zx Economy" maps and tables will load and you are good to go

jfairladyz

true to all of that skully, but how much data logging do we all do in our day to day driving??? I dont know about you but I dont do any. Sure datalogging will be helpful until you get it all tuned. But once you acheive a state of perfect tune why would you need to tune on the fly??? Why would you need the datalogging anymore??? We've got gauges to tell us what the engine is doing after that point. Sure it would be nice on a race track to find out what was going on where, but for daily driving it's really not something I consider important AT ALL. As long as my car is running right, then that is all I care about.

MS is not some complicated system dust. And Dust, I dont know where you got the whole "constantly adjusting for driving style" thing from. This isn't a carbureter. Do you have to constantly adjust the factory EFI for your driving style? That is the whole point of EFI, once you tune it for your particular "setup" (not driving style), you dont need to mess with it anymore (considering you did it right the first). The ECU will compensate for whatever conditions may arise. It works on the same principles as any other EFI system. As far as wiring goes, it's not nearly as compicated wiring MS as it is to wire the factory system. MS doesn't have as much BS include with it so there is less to wire. There is no real need for seperate "modes" if you get it tuned properly.

Skully

I was referring to the initial install and tune...i wouldnt want to run blind first time i fire my engine. I want to see what the computer is doing and what my engine is sending to the computer, i dont trust the gauges. Also if you go into MegaTune...and drive your car while have a friend monitor the screen..you can alter points in your VE and Spark maps realtime, this way you can optimise for best preformance or whatever you are looking for. Also if your car is just a daily driver and you want it set ONCE and not mess with it...well go the z31 ECU way. This way you dont have to mess around with all the parametars that MS requires.

EatmyDust

well again I don't know much about the MS system, but at first I was under the impresion that it was more of a manule control computer. You know, the kind were the computer caries out the actions, but you tell it to, or how. I wasn't under the impression that it made adjustments on its own. I do understand again that it is better than the stock ecu that is in the car, but by openion I couldn't see myself going through the conversion. If I truely want the oltemate power and performance, I will get a younger car. yea its more expensive, but it will be a little more advanced than the zx is with mega squirt I think.

rxKaffee

Most "younger" cars don't come from the factory with a tuneable ecu either though, so you would still be left having to put in your own methods of manipulating your air/fuel ratio...

If ancient cars like our Zs were the only ones that required an aftermarket ecu inorder to tune, there would not be nearly so many options for standalones and piggybacks availiable.

rxKaffee

Does the z31 ecu, when used with our engines, allow one to manipulate the fuel map or something? I've not heard anything about why someone would use the z31 ecu... I know the rb ecu's allow adjustments of ratio through the Consult interface, never heard of anything like that for the z31 though.

Or maby it just has one static map, thats better suited for turbo applications than the map that comes with our ecu?

jfairladyz

I think you're missing the point of what I'm saying. That or you don't trully understand what megasquirt is. I said, very clearly, that a lap top should be used to to tune the vehicle and work out the bugs. This involves initial driving (preferably on a dyno as it's safer). There will undoubtedly be flat spots in the rpm range that will only be noticed while the car is put under the load of driving. Now, once you achieve the PERFECT tune, as I said earlier, you would no longer need a laptop in the vehicle. Why would you??? If it's running perfectly why would you need to do any further tuning? If datalogging is your main concern, then megasquirt is NOT for you. There are much better systems that will store the data for retrieval later so you dont need a lap top plugged into your car all the time for that purpose.

And the reason mega squirt is great for a daily driver is that is so damn inexpensive. It is lightyears ahead of the old EFI on the cars. A 300HP daily driver is something that will very much benefit from a MS system.

To dust, yes you have to manually input values into the parameters of the system. Based on those values the ECU makes it's calculations based on input from it's various sensors. MS uses a map sensor to measure engine load and pressure, it uses a TPS to measure throttle position, it uses a CTS to take into consideration engine temp, it also uses an ATS to compensate for air temperature. On top of that, the newer versions of the software can now utilize a barometric pressure sensor to sense atmopheric pressure which will help in compensating for altitude changes. Basically, you give the inputs it needs to determine how much fuel to dump when and where. The ECU does the rest and makes the compensation.

And I'm sorry, but the Z31 swap in itself just doesn't seem to be worth it to me. Combined with a piggy back controller sure, it now has potential. But by the time you factor in all those costs it's nearly as much as a megasquirt system anyways.

Skully

no i just misread you, tought you meant you dont need a laptop at all and i was trying to say its easier to tune if you have one....

jfairladyz

I love internet forums