BanditJ

I have a 1982 280ZX NA and I have sitting in the garage the Tokico Advanced Handling Suspension Kit (HPK 255) and a full set of polyurethane bushings. I expect this will lower the car and tighten up the suspension but I have no way to know just how much. But I am wondering if I should go ahead and add some new sway bars while I'm doing all this other stuff. The car is not a daily driver but it's no race car either and is just an occasional weekender. Am I in for a pretty rough ride if I add the sway bars as well? I will continue to run with the original stock 14" wheels. I have an orbital buffer and polish them up every so often and so they look pretty good. I run 215/60 tires too (I know, wrong size but I don't care if my speedo is right or not.)

Any comments, experiences or opinions?

Secondarily, and not as important but I may as well throw it in here, I have my eyes on the MSA exhaust upgrade. What's the difference between the Performance exhaust and the Aluminized, just aesthetics for a shiny pipe underneath? Are these mandrel bends with no crimps? And it looks like it comes with a muffler, is that right? I had been hearing some good things about the Dynomax Super Turbo muffler but it looks like I wouldn't need that if the MSA comes with a muffler...and how is it?

I think that's it for now. I appreciate any comments and experiences.

snwbrderphat540

it comes with a muffler, they might be a different sound between exhausts. wont make a noticble difference in performance but there is some. and they are mandrel bends no kinks. also tokico i believe lower about 1-1.5 inches nothing crazy at all and i assume this is a shocks and springs package? i have a similare setup it makes a nice performance ride. its stiff in the dips and elimantes most of the body roll. as long as you have some decent amount of tire on the rims you wont get tooth jaring ride just a great handling setup. and no need for sway bars unless you plan on doing some track racing or auto crossing they are mostly there to eliminate the rest of the body role they wont really make the ride more stiff cause thats not really how sway bars work.

thxone

Not a daily driver?...If the car in the pic is the one you speak of it looks to be in great shape. If the engine is running well you may want to reconsider making it a daily driver...they get great gas mileage when running well.

BanditJ

I'm surprised with the fast replies.

Yeah, I didn't expect any performance gains that are noticeable with a new cat-back exhaust system (we have rigid smog laws here in California and to keep my life simple, I'll play by them.) But the original muffler had the tip fall off a while ago and is rusting a bit. It sounds nicer now that it's rotting away, but I think it's time for replacement. I plan to go with the 2.5" pipes to go along with a new muffler just for some extra snarl. I am happy to hear confirmation the pipes have mandrel bends.

I also didn't think I'd want to go with sway bars but figured I would ask since my next move is the suspension and may as well do sway bars, if needed or wanted, at the same time. Since it's a weekender it might be fun to take some swervy roads on a sunny day (San Diego here) with the tops off though I figured it would make for a stiffer ride as well. It sounds like the anti-sway bars do not impact the comfort of the ride.

Yes, that image is of my 280ZX and it is just a weekend ride. I've had this particular 280ZX for 19-years now. I have a Honda Accord for my daily driver which is a better ride for what I do and I save the wear on the ZX so I should probably have it for a long time to come. (Wife can't drive a stick so nobody else ever drives it ) I have to admit though, as I get older I drive it less and less and I do more and more to the house. But it is a 26-year old car and so it is definitely not in perfect shape. I've tried to keep it up as best I can and in fact I had it re-painted (kept the original color...Platinum) about 5-years ago and about the same time I re-did all the carpet and had a new dashboard installed. Not a cover, but a full dashboard from Ni$$an. The paint isn't cheap Maaco but isn't show quality either...it looks sharp riding by down the road and that works for me. But it's been a few years I've done anything to the ZX and I think it's time to have some fun.

I appreciate the discussion and welcome more comments.

snwbrderphat540

oh i would recomend getting sway bar endlinks though, the bushings on those go out and the nuts and threads on them get crappy to so just best to replace the whole endlink

SHADY280

your kit as said above will lower your car aboot 1.5" max. it will not be good on higher speed bumps. (scraping noise) the ureathane will be very nice. the sway bars will make its stiffer a bit, but not as much as the shocks and springs. put it all together and you will handle great. dont worry about the tires, you can go to 225/60/r14's without problems.

BanditJ

Based on what I am reading here, it sounds like if the sway bars do impact the comfort of the ride, it's not much and in fact most of the change comes from the springs and shocks. That makes sense. I just wasn't sure how much the anti-sway bars would have an impact. To quote the MSA description:
For most street driven vehicles, you need to strike a good balance between performance potential and ride quality. Contrary to some stories you may hear, large sway bars will adversely affect your car's ride. Remember that sway bars are a chassis stiffener. Consider how hard you drive and the condition of your local roads. Our Motorsport sway bars are sized to make your Z handle better while retaining a ride quality similar to the stock suspension.

So by their description, it sounds like they can impact ride quality. For the 82 280ZX, MSA has a set that includes a 1" front and 7/8" rear. Made with forged ends with polyurethane bushings included.

I actually like my 215/60s size tires. They still have a nice footprint but the overall wheel is slightly smaller in height.

As for my box of bushings stuff, I will list it here in case anyone has any comment. I know absolutely nothing about this stuff.
Energy Suspension 7.7102G Strut Rod Bushing
Energy Suspension 7.3103G Front Control Arm Bushing Set
Energy Suspension 7.3105G Rear Control Arm Bushing Set
Energy Suspension 7.5110G Rear Sway Bar Bushings 20mm
Energy Suspension 9.8122G End Link Grommet Set w/ Hardware (2 boxes)
McQuay-Norris FA1287 Balljoint (2 boxes)
McQuay-Norris ES2338 Tierods/Sleeves Terminal (2 boxes)
And a plastic bag with four black plastic cap looking things, larger and smaller size, that are not labeled.

So as long as nobody needs any more surgery here or any emergency house repair, I'll be trying to locate someone to perform the upgrades to my ZX in April [edited to May...boy how time flies.] I'm excited about it.

I'm still thinking sway bars as long as the ride won't be ridiculous. I want to have fun but don't want to rattle the panels off the car during a Saturday drive.

Thanks all!

BanditJ

Update:

Because I wasn't driving the car that much (and life got in the way that helped facilitate that), I registered the car as non-operational with the DMV in 2004 which also saved me money on not having to pay the full insurance on the car. But, it seems the DMV has no record of my placing the car on non-operational status and so I got this nice surprise today that I owe $394 before I can get the temporary permit for my ZX so I can take it out and get it smogged and then get the regular registration. I was a bit steamed at this news. This $394 does not count the outlay in smogging the vehicle and then the regular insurance that will be due once I can actually register it and then the current one-year registration fee. Argh!

I think it might just be karma biting me in the behind. Though it was on non-op (or so I thought it was), I would sometimes possibly, maybe (not formally admitting to anything here) switch plates from my other car and take the ZX out for short trips in the neighborhood to keep the fluids moving about and all that.

I still plan to install the Tokico system (springs and struts)
Polyurethane bushings
MSA cat-back 2.5" exhaust
New tires, 215/60 R14
and still mulling over the anti-sway bars.

I stopped at Mossy Nissan here in Oceanside (they are probably the closest place to me even closer than your regular garages) and they said they'll install all this and they have a really good Z guy.

So that's where I stand. Two steps forward, one step back.

snwbrderphat540

pffft... sway bars? exhaust? bushings? you can do that yourself. dont even need a Z guy to do that crap ESPECIALLY a dealership

BanditJ

Naww, I can't do it. Yeah, it's feasible. But I don't have all the proper equipment and it'd take forever. I don't even own a jack. I am willing to pay to get it done, get it done properly and get it done within a reasonably quick amount of time. I'm not sure I'm going to Nissan but they are the closest to me and the first I checked out and it sounds like they have someone who knows Z's. Unless anybody else knows a really good guy in the northern San Diego area.

lww

This is why I keep copies of everything I do with the DMV. More than once, paperwork has been lost between my house and Sacramento. I doubt the Post Office is loosing it and it's most likely some incompetent at the Sac. DMV is using his trash can as an inbox. Because of this, my registration for the 280ZX 2+2 I bought back in September last year has still not been completed. I have to get a "lost title" submitted first...

BanditJ

Yeah, stupid DMV. Oh well.

An update:

I got the Tokicos in and had them install the sway bars and polyurethane bushings and the MSA 2.5" exhaust and muffler.

The Tokicos lowered the car exactly 1" every where I had measured. I don't know how people normally measure the height of the car, but I measured immediately before and after of each wheel from the well to the ground. I was at 7 3/4", 7 3/4", 8 1/4" and 10 3/16. This dropped respectively to 6 3/4", 6 3/4", 7 1/4" and 9 1/4". That's pretty much 1" spot on!

My struts must have been shot before because bumps actually seem softer now with lowering springs on. It's not a less bumpy ride, but the bumps are actually less jarring...if that makes sense.

The one other thing I notice now is that if I punch it and put the car under load, mostly up a hill, the back end bounces up and down in succession more than I remember. Small bounces but they are there.

As for the new 2.5" mandrel MSA pipe and muffler, I don't feel any HP gains (didn't really expect any but I had my fingers crossed that maybe physics would take a nap on me and give me some gains) but the car is actually a littler quieter than before. I was very surprised about that. It's quite a bit deeper in tone and I am convinced quite a bit quieter.

As I start the car to leave the place I hear some funny noise and the mechanic says the starter motor is going. Yeah, odds are that it goes the first start after taking it in for some work and repairs. Oh well. He also pointed out that my heat barrier panels in front of what I think is the steering stuff is missing. I know that wasn't him because I'd noticed it looked a lot more open in that area before I took it in. Who the heck worked on my car and didn't put those heat barrier panels back? It's always something.

Overall I'm pretty darned happy.

thetremendousti

I want to upgrade my suspension on my 260z 2+2, I want to lower it between 1.5" and 2" while improving the ride, what should I be looking for? I won't do many rim upgrades, maybe get some offset 16 or 17's but i don't think that'll be a problem. What should I be looking for shock and spring wise? Also, is replacing all the suspension bushings a difficult thing for the backyard mechanic?

wait, cancel that other edit,

what do you think of these?

http://cosmoracing.com/productinfo.asp?cid=259&pid=1468

i think it sounds pretty good, all i need are bushings and with this set i'd be set, right?

SHADY280

bandit. your upgrades are a great start, i have the large sway bars, infact i have the 1/1/8 front, not just the 1. it really helps with body roll, and didnt really stiffen it up badly. it just feels tighter. mixed with your current upgrades, you will be surprized how far your car will go, even tho you didnt think it ever would. if you can, go to a parking lot and do large circles, and see how fast you can go to see where it breaks loose. front or rear. its fun to try, just dont get caught by the police.

BanditJ

I pulled the car out onto the driveway and snapped a photo. I'll try to attach it but it's a large photo because I haven't edited it. I hope it's not too big and I just committed a faux paus.

The car isn't super low but I'm not sure I'd want it any lower than this. As you can see I have the 14" rims and I'm running 215/60's and so I'd have room for a bigger wheel and tire combo. But I kind of like the smaller'ish wheels/tires. I don't think I'd want to go with anything over 16s.

I'm really bummed about the starter motor. Though the car literally sat with a dead battery for over one-year and probably closer to two, it was starting just fine the ten times I drove it the past couple weeks and the minute I go to pick up my car it's acting up. The coffers are getting kind of empty over here and now I don't want to be driving the car too far. Either I get that noise from the starter motor that you usually get when trying to start the car when it's already running or I get a "Zzzz-zzz" and nothing happens. Rats!

Tremendous, I'm probably the last person to offer any advice. Two-inches seems a bit much to me but I know others have done similar though I have no clue what type of ride you could expect.

Shady, thanks for the great start comment. Because of the starter motor issues, I'm not going to be playing around with the car too much. I also need new tires as well. These are very old, dry and worn. And, there aren't too many places to be a hooligan safely around here but I'm sure at some point I'll see what I can do.

The photo is below and you can compare it with an older shot in my signature. I'll be changing that signature in a week or two though to reflect my Z's current status.

BanditJ

I'll throw in one of my interior. I need seats badly. And my speedometer is broken. That's next on the agenda after a new starter motor and tires.

Mhinrichs

I got seats for ya. They are leather and just about the same color as the ones you got pictured.

BanditJ

Hey, that's kind of you. However, I may have made it seem replacing the seats is more urgent than it really is. It's on my agenda and the seats need replacing, but I have to hold off for a while considering I just threw a bunch of money at the car a couple days ago. Also, I plan to replace my seats with black seats and definitely not old 280ZX seats.

Take care!

lww

Your seats look fine to me. The problem with the starter is very common. Here's a reman unit from Kragen/Parts America for $69

http://www.partsamerica.com/ProductD...pe=123&PTSet=A

You can easily put it in yourself.

zstudent

hey bandit do you by and chance have a video or some audio, I am going to have a similar exhaust set up on my 79 and want to know what it sounds like, and how did the smogging go, (riverside/san diego resident)

BanditJ

Actually, I smogged it the morning before I took it in to have all this stuff done. I passed smog no problem. But I don't think these cat-back pipes should interfere with smogging in anyway.

I can maybe try and shoot a video with sound for you. I wouldn't be able to do that any time soon and it might be a week or two. The MSA site states the pipes are louder but, unless I'm completely mistaken, it's no louder and in fact I think a little quieter because it is a lower tone.

thetremendousti

so back to me...

WildmaN

Nice man....that is a good height right there. Looks more aggressive and sporty that way. Clean Z bro'..keep it sweet.

snwbrderphat540

shady.... where did you get sway bars that thick from?

Devil280ZX

I have my old speedo lying around if you want it. Just pay for shipping and its yours.