New Z Owner
09-26-2005, 06:47 PM
#1
Registered User
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 4
New Z Owner
Hello. I am a new owner of a 1977 280Z. I have owned many British Sportscars and am familiar with what to correct while going over an older car to repair and recondition. Are there any common weakness or defects in the Z which one should pay attention to while doing repairs over the winter. Thanks, Dave.
09-27-2005, 08:48 AM
#2
Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Boulder, CO
Posts: 474
Congratulations on your purchase! I'm sure you'll be very happy with it. The three most common problems are rust, rust, and also rust. I'll assume you went over the car with a fine-tooth comb looking for that before you bought it, though (or know where the rust is and already have plans for dealing with it). In all seriousness, though, here's what comes to mind in my experience, in no particular order. Sorry, it's kinda long. I'm sure others here will have some really good info, too.
Obviously all the usual suspects when buying a used car. Plugs, wires, cap and rotor, all filters and fluids, etc.
Other known issues would include the bushings and straps in the differential mounts, which dry out and rot and can cause the infamous Z-car "clunk" sound from back there.
Check out the nuts/bolts at the tops of your struts, too. They can come loose and cause a clunk or rattle as well. Coincidentally, that's a good chance to install a strut bar.
You'll also want to check out the u-joints on the half shafts. They all eventually die, and there're a lot of good options on how to fix/replace them. If the previous owner hadn't done it recently, you'll definitely be having to do it soon.
Go ahead and just change the fluid in the tranny (and diff for that matter). The stock 5-speed 1st gen isn't as durable as we're used to by newer standards, so plan on replacing it at some point in the future. If you have a 4 speed, winter would be a great time to replace it with a 5 speed from a 280ZX (there's a lot more info on that topic if you're interested). There're two models there, a bolt-on from the non-turbo which is a bit stronger, nicer, etc. and a hard to find Borg T5 that came on the turbos, which can be installed, but is more difficult and involved.
If the compression on the engine is good, you should be fine. 7 main bearings means the bottom end should be in great shape, barring dumb moves by previous owners (like not changing oil or over-revving it, etc.). The big, long, aluminum head is usually pretty reliable, but people are known to crack or warp them, and that can be a pain to fix (see fast240Z's string of posts as he's trying to get his car running right now). Just watch for water in cylinders and/or water/oil mixing.
I've never personally had a water pump on a 280 fail in the last 12 years. However, I'm thinking I'm pretty lucky on that count. There seems to be a number of folks who swear it's a weakness. I'm going with an electric one on my current project. Winter would be a good time to do that.
It can be difficult to keep a 1st gen Z cool. If you're radiator's not in great shape after a flush, consider having it steamed, or just replacing/upgrading it (aluminum, 4-row, good options).
It might not hurt to drop, or at least completely drain, the gas tank. And of course replace the fuel filter. The 280Z's EFI is an awesome, simple, easy to work on system (well, relative to other EFI's...), but it's really picky about debris in the gas. Speaking of the EFI, if the wiring plugs to the injectors are disintegrating, consider wiring in nice new upgrade replacements (with a better wire retainer). I've used the set from Motorsport (zcarparts.com) and have been very pleased with the results. I'd guess others probably carry them, too. While you're doing that, replace any of the Hiprex fuel rail to injector hoses that don't look good and new, and use clamps instead of that weird bushing collar that was stock. If you really want to do it up nicely, send your injectors out to a flow shop and get them to clean and test them. Then you can be sure of consistent optimum fuel delivery across all cylinders.
Fuel pressure regulators are known to go bad, which will cause lean conditions and loss of power at higher revs. So replacing that might not hurt.
The oil pressure sender on Z's are almost always bad. They're cheap to replace, but I don't know as the replacements last all that long, either. I don't know why nobody ever made one that works, but I guess if Datsun had to mess up a part, this is a pretty harmless one, and they got most everything else nearly perfect.
A new urethane bushing kit for the suspension can really help out the feel and handling of the car if it's still got the old now-rotted and dead rubber ones. A kit is about $150. The installation isn't bad if you've got a lot of liquid wrench, patience, and an impact wrench. There are a few pieces that, once off of the car, you'll want to just take to someone with a hydraulic press. The rear lower control arm spindle bushings are one example. I use a 4-wheeler friend's press (he uses my engine hoist, so it's a fair trade), but nearly any shop or auto parts dealer with a machine shop will do it relatively cheaply. It's a lot better than pounding on it with a hammer for hours.
While you're down around the wheels, it might be time to replace the tired rubber brake lines with new braided stainless. I thought this was more of a dress-up upgrade, until I had to replace some dead lines and figured "why not". I really do think the stainless feel better under hard braking, and they're cheap. The next step beyond that for the brakes is to replace the front calipers with early 80's Toyota 4x4 4 piston calipers. They bolt right on, seriously.
There are other upgrades beyond that for bigger, vented rotors, rear disc conversion, etc. but of course those cost more cash. They might be worth it depending on where you live, how you drive, what you'll do with the car, etc. Definitely worth it in mountainous areas, hot climates, or for competition use. Or if you just want to have nice looking massive rotors peeking out from behind a nice set of wheels for car shows.
Check out the weatherstripping on the hatch, as well as the grommets for the vapor collection lines where they come up from the tank on their way to the vapor collection tank (in the fender, above the filler tube), and the rear taillight seals. This sounds like a dumb thing to waste time on, but actually there's a good reason. The awesome shape of the Z has a drawback in that it creates a weird pressure gradient that basically makes it want to pull exhaust fumes into the car in the back. So, those seals are important. At best, bad seals will make your driving experience smell like you're stuck in traffic.
Speaking of aerodynamics, if your Z didn't come with an airdam, you may want to consider one. The info I've seen on here and in SportZ magazine indicates that above 80 mph or so, the stock Z shape creates about 100 lbs of lift. But it's mostly due to too much air going under the car. Air dams aren't expensive (painting them to match can be), and there's a lot of variety from which to choose.
Well, that's what I can think of. There are a lot of very helpful people on here, who I'm sure will post, too. But hopefully this'll give you some ideas. Happy wrenching.
Dave
Obviously all the usual suspects when buying a used car. Plugs, wires, cap and rotor, all filters and fluids, etc.
Other known issues would include the bushings and straps in the differential mounts, which dry out and rot and can cause the infamous Z-car "clunk" sound from back there.
Check out the nuts/bolts at the tops of your struts, too. They can come loose and cause a clunk or rattle as well. Coincidentally, that's a good chance to install a strut bar.
You'll also want to check out the u-joints on the half shafts. They all eventually die, and there're a lot of good options on how to fix/replace them. If the previous owner hadn't done it recently, you'll definitely be having to do it soon.
Go ahead and just change the fluid in the tranny (and diff for that matter). The stock 5-speed 1st gen isn't as durable as we're used to by newer standards, so plan on replacing it at some point in the future. If you have a 4 speed, winter would be a great time to replace it with a 5 speed from a 280ZX (there's a lot more info on that topic if you're interested). There're two models there, a bolt-on from the non-turbo which is a bit stronger, nicer, etc. and a hard to find Borg T5 that came on the turbos, which can be installed, but is more difficult and involved.
If the compression on the engine is good, you should be fine. 7 main bearings means the bottom end should be in great shape, barring dumb moves by previous owners (like not changing oil or over-revving it, etc.). The big, long, aluminum head is usually pretty reliable, but people are known to crack or warp them, and that can be a pain to fix (see fast240Z's string of posts as he's trying to get his car running right now). Just watch for water in cylinders and/or water/oil mixing.
I've never personally had a water pump on a 280 fail in the last 12 years. However, I'm thinking I'm pretty lucky on that count. There seems to be a number of folks who swear it's a weakness. I'm going with an electric one on my current project. Winter would be a good time to do that.
It can be difficult to keep a 1st gen Z cool. If you're radiator's not in great shape after a flush, consider having it steamed, or just replacing/upgrading it (aluminum, 4-row, good options).
It might not hurt to drop, or at least completely drain, the gas tank. And of course replace the fuel filter. The 280Z's EFI is an awesome, simple, easy to work on system (well, relative to other EFI's...), but it's really picky about debris in the gas. Speaking of the EFI, if the wiring plugs to the injectors are disintegrating, consider wiring in nice new upgrade replacements (with a better wire retainer). I've used the set from Motorsport (zcarparts.com) and have been very pleased with the results. I'd guess others probably carry them, too. While you're doing that, replace any of the Hiprex fuel rail to injector hoses that don't look good and new, and use clamps instead of that weird bushing collar that was stock. If you really want to do it up nicely, send your injectors out to a flow shop and get them to clean and test them. Then you can be sure of consistent optimum fuel delivery across all cylinders.
Fuel pressure regulators are known to go bad, which will cause lean conditions and loss of power at higher revs. So replacing that might not hurt.
The oil pressure sender on Z's are almost always bad. They're cheap to replace, but I don't know as the replacements last all that long, either. I don't know why nobody ever made one that works, but I guess if Datsun had to mess up a part, this is a pretty harmless one, and they got most everything else nearly perfect.
A new urethane bushing kit for the suspension can really help out the feel and handling of the car if it's still got the old now-rotted and dead rubber ones. A kit is about $150. The installation isn't bad if you've got a lot of liquid wrench, patience, and an impact wrench. There are a few pieces that, once off of the car, you'll want to just take to someone with a hydraulic press. The rear lower control arm spindle bushings are one example. I use a 4-wheeler friend's press (he uses my engine hoist, so it's a fair trade), but nearly any shop or auto parts dealer with a machine shop will do it relatively cheaply. It's a lot better than pounding on it with a hammer for hours.
While you're down around the wheels, it might be time to replace the tired rubber brake lines with new braided stainless. I thought this was more of a dress-up upgrade, until I had to replace some dead lines and figured "why not". I really do think the stainless feel better under hard braking, and they're cheap. The next step beyond that for the brakes is to replace the front calipers with early 80's Toyota 4x4 4 piston calipers. They bolt right on, seriously.
There are other upgrades beyond that for bigger, vented rotors, rear disc conversion, etc. but of course those cost more cash. They might be worth it depending on where you live, how you drive, what you'll do with the car, etc. Definitely worth it in mountainous areas, hot climates, or for competition use. Or if you just want to have nice looking massive rotors peeking out from behind a nice set of wheels for car shows.
Check out the weatherstripping on the hatch, as well as the grommets for the vapor collection lines where they come up from the tank on their way to the vapor collection tank (in the fender, above the filler tube), and the rear taillight seals. This sounds like a dumb thing to waste time on, but actually there's a good reason. The awesome shape of the Z has a drawback in that it creates a weird pressure gradient that basically makes it want to pull exhaust fumes into the car in the back. So, those seals are important. At best, bad seals will make your driving experience smell like you're stuck in traffic.
Speaking of aerodynamics, if your Z didn't come with an airdam, you may want to consider one. The info I've seen on here and in SportZ magazine indicates that above 80 mph or so, the stock Z shape creates about 100 lbs of lift. But it's mostly due to too much air going under the car. Air dams aren't expensive (painting them to match can be), and there's a lot of variety from which to choose.
Well, that's what I can think of. There are a lot of very helpful people on here, who I'm sure will post, too. But hopefully this'll give you some ideas. Happy wrenching.
Dave
Last edited by BoulderZ; 09-27-2005 at 08:49 AM. Reason: needed to put in paragraph indentations
09-27-2005, 05:35 PM
#3
Registered User
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 4
BoulderZ, I would like to thank you for the extensive response. I purchased the car from the second owner who drove it 900 miles over the last 8 years. The car has always been properly stored and never winter driven.
As far as I can see there is no visible rust in the engine compartment, trunk, wheel wells floors etc. but the truth will be known once on the hoist. If it were rusty I would not have purchased it. It has 71000 miles. I have adopted many various British cars over the years and have always lusted over the Z. I am very excited about this car and am already enjoying it. I usually change all fluids, filters immediately. The car will be getting new distributor cap, rotor, wires and plugs. As well most rubber is dried out including the fuel line to the injectors, and wiring plug covers for the injectors are dry rotted. I will look into replacing the harness rather than shrink wrapping them.
I have ordered catalogues from Victoria British and Motorsport. These seem to be the predominate parts suppliers that sell more than seat covers and carpet. Are there any other suppliers recommended? Does the Nissan dealer still carry some parts?
The car does have the rear end clunk that I read so much about. Had the same problem with my Triumph TR6 and repaired that several years ago including U joints, mounts and reinforcement etc. I will need a Haynes manual.
Thanks for the advice regarding the fuel pressure regulator. The PO told me that the fuel pump need replacing due to low pressure resulting in loss of power as the engine warmed up.
I am looking forward to using this car for touring. Usually round trips of 500 miles or so. I love the low revs in 5th gear and the ability to travel at high speed on the highway.
If there are any other suggested catalogue suppliers, or repair manuals I would appreciate hearing about them.
Thanks so much, it looks like a good group here and appreciate the assistance.
Dave
As far as I can see there is no visible rust in the engine compartment, trunk, wheel wells floors etc. but the truth will be known once on the hoist. If it were rusty I would not have purchased it. It has 71000 miles. I have adopted many various British cars over the years and have always lusted over the Z. I am very excited about this car and am already enjoying it. I usually change all fluids, filters immediately. The car will be getting new distributor cap, rotor, wires and plugs. As well most rubber is dried out including the fuel line to the injectors, and wiring plug covers for the injectors are dry rotted. I will look into replacing the harness rather than shrink wrapping them.
I have ordered catalogues from Victoria British and Motorsport. These seem to be the predominate parts suppliers that sell more than seat covers and carpet. Are there any other suppliers recommended? Does the Nissan dealer still carry some parts?
The car does have the rear end clunk that I read so much about. Had the same problem with my Triumph TR6 and repaired that several years ago including U joints, mounts and reinforcement etc. I will need a Haynes manual.
Thanks for the advice regarding the fuel pressure regulator. The PO told me that the fuel pump need replacing due to low pressure resulting in loss of power as the engine warmed up.
I am looking forward to using this car for touring. Usually round trips of 500 miles or so. I love the low revs in 5th gear and the ability to travel at high speed on the highway.
If there are any other suggested catalogue suppliers, or repair manuals I would appreciate hearing about them.
Thanks so much, it looks like a good group here and appreciate the assistance.
Dave
09-28-2005, 09:52 AM
#4
Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Boulder, CO
Posts: 474
Hi Dave,
Glad to help! Sounds like you got a hold of a really nice Z. Mine wasn't nearly as rust free, though after nearly two years of body work, it's rust free now. To get one in the kind of condition you have really saves a lot of money, time, and effort. Also sounds like you've got all the usuals under good control, and a good plan for doing the other work. Your experience with British cars should help a lot, too.
Vic Brit and Motorsport are definitely the 2 biggest suppliers. I find myself calling Motorsport every other week to order 5 to 10 items as I reassemble my '78. I've been very happy with the products and services I've gotten from them over the years.
Some other ones I've used, also with good results:
http://www.zspecialties.com/
http://www.zparts.com/home.html
http://www.zcarsource.com/
Other suppliers, whom I haven't tried, would include:
http://www.arizonazcar.com/
http://www.datsunrestore.com/
http://www.modern-motorsports.com/catalog/default.php
http://www.datsunzparts.com/
Some dealers do still have quite a few parts available. I've had mixed results with the dealer here in Boulder. Some of the people there are helpful and obviously dig old Z's, and others won't give you the time of day unless you're buying a loaded xTerrArmada. Might just be a Colorado SUV obsession thing. Not a ton of sports cars around here. However, quite a few dealers have made supporting all Z cars their cause celebre. One of the best in the country for Z's is:
http://www.courtesynissan.com/en_US/HomePage_1.chtml
The nice thing about Courtesy Nissan is they have CD-ROM versions of the factory service manual, which is an absolute must-have. Especially the whole-car wiring schematic and the EFI section. The printed originals have been unavailable for at least 10 years now (for the 280 Z's anyway). While I was babysitting my brother's 280 (he was in NYC temporarily), he left his with me. UnfortuanI had to give it back with the car when he moved back to Seattle. I had tried to bid for them on e-Bay and always lost out when it got over $80. I'll pay that much for a rare science text or maybe some special first edition literary classic, but not a book I'm going to drag under the car and get greasy and oily. The nice thing about the CD ROM version is also that I can print the relevant page(s) and tape it/them up near where I'm working, write on it, etc. and if they get destroyed it's no loss.
Another must-have book is Wick Humble's _How To Restore Your Datsun Z Car_ It's available through Motorsport or Amazon or Barnes and Noble. It's an awesome how-to book, especially for major restore projects. I've probably read it 10 times. I have three copies, one in the garage in the roll-away, one on the coffee table in the living room, and one at my desk. I'm not sure how that all happened, but it's turning out to be very convenient. There are some other good ones as well, How To Rebuild Your Datsun OHC Engine, How To Modify Your Datsun OHC Engine, How To Tune and Modify Bosch Fuel Injection, etc. A lot of good picks for family members who want to support your Z enthusiasm in the coming holiday season.
Also a very useful publication is SportZ Magazine: http://www.sportzmagazine.com
They've got quite a few knowledgeable writers, and a good mix info on Z's from the first Fairlady's up to decked out still-smell-new 350's, and even some G35 info.
And of course, this site's very useful. Theramz has a scary amount of early Z knowledge, as do quite a few others on here, too. I find it very encouraging to check this site when things are a bit frustrating on my project. Congratulations again on your purchase, and happy wrenching!
Dave
Glad to help! Sounds like you got a hold of a really nice Z. Mine wasn't nearly as rust free, though after nearly two years of body work, it's rust free now. To get one in the kind of condition you have really saves a lot of money, time, and effort. Also sounds like you've got all the usuals under good control, and a good plan for doing the other work. Your experience with British cars should help a lot, too.
Vic Brit and Motorsport are definitely the 2 biggest suppliers. I find myself calling Motorsport every other week to order 5 to 10 items as I reassemble my '78. I've been very happy with the products and services I've gotten from them over the years.
Some other ones I've used, also with good results:
http://www.zspecialties.com/
http://www.zparts.com/home.html
http://www.zcarsource.com/
Other suppliers, whom I haven't tried, would include:
http://www.arizonazcar.com/
http://www.datsunrestore.com/
http://www.modern-motorsports.com/catalog/default.php
http://www.datsunzparts.com/
Some dealers do still have quite a few parts available. I've had mixed results with the dealer here in Boulder. Some of the people there are helpful and obviously dig old Z's, and others won't give you the time of day unless you're buying a loaded xTerrArmada. Might just be a Colorado SUV obsession thing. Not a ton of sports cars around here. However, quite a few dealers have made supporting all Z cars their cause celebre. One of the best in the country for Z's is:
http://www.courtesynissan.com/en_US/HomePage_1.chtml
The nice thing about Courtesy Nissan is they have CD-ROM versions of the factory service manual, which is an absolute must-have. Especially the whole-car wiring schematic and the EFI section. The printed originals have been unavailable for at least 10 years now (for the 280 Z's anyway). While I was babysitting my brother's 280 (he was in NYC temporarily), he left his with me. UnfortuanI had to give it back with the car when he moved back to Seattle. I had tried to bid for them on e-Bay and always lost out when it got over $80. I'll pay that much for a rare science text or maybe some special first edition literary classic, but not a book I'm going to drag under the car and get greasy and oily. The nice thing about the CD ROM version is also that I can print the relevant page(s) and tape it/them up near where I'm working, write on it, etc. and if they get destroyed it's no loss.
Another must-have book is Wick Humble's _How To Restore Your Datsun Z Car_ It's available through Motorsport or Amazon or Barnes and Noble. It's an awesome how-to book, especially for major restore projects. I've probably read it 10 times. I have three copies, one in the garage in the roll-away, one on the coffee table in the living room, and one at my desk. I'm not sure how that all happened, but it's turning out to be very convenient. There are some other good ones as well, How To Rebuild Your Datsun OHC Engine, How To Modify Your Datsun OHC Engine, How To Tune and Modify Bosch Fuel Injection, etc. A lot of good picks for family members who want to support your Z enthusiasm in the coming holiday season.
Also a very useful publication is SportZ Magazine: http://www.sportzmagazine.com
They've got quite a few knowledgeable writers, and a good mix info on Z's from the first Fairlady's up to decked out still-smell-new 350's, and even some G35 info.
And of course, this site's very useful. Theramz has a scary amount of early Z knowledge, as do quite a few others on here, too. I find it very encouraging to check this site when things are a bit frustrating on my project. Congratulations again on your purchase, and happy wrenching!
Dave
10-01-2005, 05:43 PM
#5
Registered User
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 4
I would like to thank BoulderZ for the great websites. I have ordered a Haynes manual and How to restore your Datsun Z car. Hope to get them next week.
Things are moving along well on the car. Ends up that the local mechanic who I trust and had do the Safety Certificate has owned two Zs and is very familiar with the car. It needed a muffler and a brake hose to pass. I had him change all injector O rings, fuel lines, new plugs, wires, rotor, cap etc. and the car runs great!
There are several remaining issues that I would like to correct before winter storage. Several electrical issues being that the clock, fuel gauge, cigarette lighter do not work. I have checked the fuses and they are good. The fuel gauge falls below empty with the key off, and then goes to E when the key is on. The interior light can be turned on, but does not light when the door is opened. Before I start ripping and tearing away at the dash are there any hidden fuse that I do not see?
Secondly, the car runs well but the engine must turn over for almost 10 seconds before firing up. Is this normal? Any suggestions?
I do appreciate the help available on these sites and hope to learn enough about these cars to provide assistance to others some day. My original post had been on the wrong section of this forum, but I will continue along here to keep my original topic continue.
Thank you very much, Dave
Things are moving along well on the car. Ends up that the local mechanic who I trust and had do the Safety Certificate has owned two Zs and is very familiar with the car. It needed a muffler and a brake hose to pass. I had him change all injector O rings, fuel lines, new plugs, wires, rotor, cap etc. and the car runs great!
There are several remaining issues that I would like to correct before winter storage. Several electrical issues being that the clock, fuel gauge, cigarette lighter do not work. I have checked the fuses and they are good. The fuel gauge falls below empty with the key off, and then goes to E when the key is on. The interior light can be turned on, but does not light when the door is opened. Before I start ripping and tearing away at the dash are there any hidden fuse that I do not see?
Secondly, the car runs well but the engine must turn over for almost 10 seconds before firing up. Is this normal? Any suggestions?
I do appreciate the help available on these sites and hope to learn enough about these cars to provide assistance to others some day. My original post had been on the wrong section of this forum, but I will continue along here to keep my original topic continue.
Thank you very much, Dave
Last edited by brdave; 10-01-2005 at 05:47 PM. Reason: indent paragraphs
10-04-2005, 03:13 PM
#6
Guest
Posts: n/a
my car had hard starting with the previous owner...he went through 4 starters in 2-3 years. the output line from the gas tank before the rear fuel pump was clogged and I used a braided steel cable and used it like a roto-rooter and in about an hour I had that fixed. but my z has the twin su carbs...with the efi system there are soo many more variables of things that can go wrong than the simple carb setup of an earlier Z...imo...but I am biased...
good luck on your Z
good luck on your Z
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
Bookmarks
