Hello guys, I am 16 and am looking at a manual transmission 1990 300ZX 2+2 N/A to buy for $3500. The person I am buying it from is the original owner and is also my teacher hehe. The car seems to be in decent shape with 80,000 miles and no accident history. Exterior is fine with a few paint chips but could use a paint job. Interior doesnt seem to good with the drivers seat (leather) ripped open exposing the metal frame and the same with the passenger seat but I guess thats just the natural aging of the car and can be fixed. My question is whether you all think it is a good deal in the long run, accounting overall reliability and insurance costs. I have some more questions but I feel like this is long enough and Ill ask some more when people reply hehe.

 

At 16, this car will render you broke.

If you were in a better financial position, I'd say it's not bad... $3500 for a Z32 with 80k is reasonable.

And have you actually seen the car or are you relaying information poorly? I ask because torn leather on a seat will expose the copious amounts of foam padding underneath... there'd have to be something seriously wrong to see the metal frame.

 

Yeah Ive seen the car up close in person numerous times. Mechanically she says its running fine since everything has been serviced but she said at one time the mechanic felt bad for her and discounted the price of the parts going on the car since there were so many going on at one time. Other than that she says its reliable, and the clutch only been replaced twice in 20 years and other stuff. She only drives it to and from school which is one mile for her. Oh yeah and the metal frame, sorry badly worded but it is ripped exposing a metal piece in one area.
Financially, I can afford the car its just the insurance Im worried about.

Also im interested in what you guys would rank each category
Reliability: 1-10
Insurance: 1-10 - doesnt really help me but interested
Overall Long term Performance: 1-10

Trying to lower the price down to 2800-3000 too

 

Insurance is going to be expensive as hell for a 16 year old. I was paying $235 a month for full coverage on a Z32 when I was 17 (and that was with a full coverage discount and also multiple coverage discount - also had a life insurance policy because the discount was more than the insurance itself).

Long term performance on a 2+2 NA is not good at all. If you want performance, you have to swap in a Twin Turbo motor (which is a LOT of work).

Reliability on a Z32 costing under $10,000 is gonna be low. Listen to the story you just told me... seriously.
And you're not a woman - he's not gonna discount the price for you. Every Z32 owner I know (including myself) recommends keeping at LEAST $1000 in a bank account for repairs, just in case anything goes wrong.

It's not that the Z32 itself isn't reliable, it's that a) cheap Z32s aren't reliable b) maintenance on the Z32 is EXPENSIVE. For example, on her 90, expect at least one injector to go out on an annual basis (you can thank our politicians pushing ethanol-mixed fuels for this). To replace each injector, you're looking at $150 + hours of labor. And to prevent that from happening, you have to swap to the pintle-less injectors of the 94+ Z32, which is a ~$600+ retrofit.

 

Hmm.. I'm going along with what you are saying and it truly does seem like quite some burden in the long run, but I think before abandoning it it wouldnt hurt to take it to a mechanic to check it out and to make a call to insuance wouldnt it? I'm flustered and don't know what to say because I am taking your advice but I also am really interested in the car. Oh just read the seconed half you posted (though it was your signature) eh...

 

A mechanic can look at it to find current problems, but water pumps, injectors, etc go out without warning.

On the plus side, for you, though, the NA is more reliable (and has less things that can go bad) than a TT.

I'm not saying not to buy the car... I just want you to be fully aware of how expensive the Z32 can be to own and operate. As I said, I was 17 when I bought a Z32 (it was a Twin Turbo). I don't regret it one bit, but I worked a LOT just to be able to afford everything, and spent a large portion of my college fund fixing things when the turbos went out on me.

 

Oh...alright well now I have a better understanding of what to expect in ownership. From what I read from other people online I shuold check water pump, timing belt and injectors like you mentioned (anything else you suggest)? I hear they can take a mean bite out of the wallet-"expensive to maintain" like you said

I think that if it checks out with the mechanic and insurance, I will probably buy it. Cosmetic problems such as the seat wouldnt be a big deal for me. I think what I'll do next is go for the test drive ive been anticipating for awhile and post some pics of it.

Btw I was really expecting you to discourage me not to get it based on your posts on Z Fever's thread. You really thrashed him.

 

That's because you didn't say things like...

He's an immature **** who doesn't deserve a Z32. You don't come off as someone who'll drive like a retard. I was responsible when I was 16/17/18, so I know some people can be. But when you ask "can you still drift and do burnouts" and comment on how the TT is "menacing in the eyes of ricers," you're not the type of person I want as a part of the Z32 community. Not to mention (as I said in the other thread):

Check out TwinTurbo.NET sometime (it's not just for Twin Turbos)... respectable people, entirely... as Z32 owners should be.

 

What mechanic? Is he experienced with Z32's? I work part time as a mechanic doing strictly Z32 work (for the most part, I do work on other things when requested at the shop though) and the head mechanic (who built a 500 WHP+ turbo Genesis, 600+ EVO, turbo conversion on 350z, some other sweet rides) takes me to school on any other car basically, until it comes to Z32's.

Sure, they ideas and general conceptions are the same (a combustion engine is a combustion engine), but the z32 is a whole other world. Make sure your mechanic knows what he's doing on a Z32 before he just gives you the "A ok".

Also, take into account that the mechanic is a business man and is out there to make money and SOME mechanics will say something is fine, knowing it isn't, because they know you'll be there a month later to give them your money.

How well do you know the mechanic is all I'm saying.

One thing that will help with insurance, have your parents purchase it under their policy and list you as the driver. This will give you an additional discount (multi-car discount).. Also, work hard in school, get good grades, you can get a "good student discount". Do your parents have a garage? Park the Z in it, and SOME insurance companies will offer you a discount for this.

I bought my first car (a Z32) when I was 17 as well... Not counting the TT swap and other bull ****, after around 1500 put into it, it was extremely reliable. I managed to find a Z32 that hadn't been worn out and ragged on though.

If it's a one owner car, and she's a school teacher, and a woman, odds are, it probably hasn't been ragged out and the engine is still strong.

You can't really check the water pump or timing belt without tearing the car apart. Just ask her if she can provide receipts and documentation on when the timing belt was replaced (supposed to be done every 60k miles). Make sure when the timing belt / water pump was replaced, they also replaced the timing belt tensioner.

injectors can easily be checked with a multi-meter. 12 - 14 ohms. As Zlover said, they can go out because of the ethanol fuel, and the solution is the new style injectors. Unless you do the ECU rewire, which is more than likely a little bit above your head at this point in time (and a lot of other recent new posters, which is mainly why I don't think I've seen him recommend it here lately), and I mean no offense meant by that, when I bought my Z32, I didn't even know what a vacuum line was, now I've done TT swaps and all kinds of other junk, it just takes time, a willingness to learn, and a copy of the FSM to read while your pooping.

 

No, the mechanic who services our cars isnt specialized with 300ZX but personally we know him and he does a sturdy job with everything, hopefully hell point out what's wrong. I talked to her shortly today about the injectors, clutch, and timing belt. She said they have all been "fixed" but she knows It wont just go by that word, so she'll provide all the papers of the car being serviced. Also discussed electrical problems, she mentioned something about the starter where you had to flick it on at one point to start it and couldnt hold it down- "Fixed"- and will have papers for further detail.

Insurance, I made a free quote with only me on the car and it's $161/mo. I think I could handle this but what do you guys think... and Ill make a quote under my parents-should it be my dad's "pleasure or weekend" vehicle? School discount I already put down, adn Ill try the garage discount.

She says she will be cleaning up the car this weekend so I can take it for a spin. Ill look at the papers in grave detail.

Yeah youre right, I have no hands-on experience in maintaining vehicles and all that, but I guess you could say I have a "fair" knowledge about parts and functions so no work for now IF I get it.

Eh...maybe some pics Ill upload, I feel like nobody would care but whatever, and some more questions when they come up.

Thanks for tips and advice by the way!

 

If you don't have money to play with (minimum $2,000) in the bank specifically for your car, forget it. When i was your age i had a supra, and if it wasn't for my dad i'd be in bad debt. I really regret buying it and not waiting till i was a wee bit older..believe me, WAIT.

The first week i got my Z, i drove it like hell just to make any problems arise (i did it purposely) and boom!, 1 injector gone, wiring harness corroded, temp sensor malfunctioning, tranny gone, power-steering pump+line shot...everything at a cost of 3300ish dollars..2 months into me owning it!. But now it runs mint

Keep in mind it IS a 20 year old car.

 

I have had my 1993 nissan 300zx 2+2 non turbo automatic since 2002 its 2010 now i have gone threw one engine only due to a dumb *** mechanic who never worked on a z32 before. this mechanic worked at a nissan dealership to boot ! never the less i paid twice the ammount you are gonna spend. so far i have put at least 7,000 dollars worth of work in the last 8 years. 1000 dollars a year minus oil changes. and gasonline figure about 250 a month on insurance gas and oil changes if you do drive alot. I only drive my Z32 on the weekends . Or about 2 days a week.

 

Alright, well listening to all your stories I'll be more cautious and think alot more about buying this car. I'll go for the test drive and try the best to find all faults and fix-ups to be needed. Previously stated, She does only drive to school and no where else in it so that may be a indication that it may still currently have problems. If I do decide to go thorugh with the deal, it sounds for sure, thorugh your stories, that I will be spending at least 1000 a year-"rendering me broke" eventually-. And by hearing everyone's input on it's reliability, I will probably be asking dad for some money a couple times.

It seems though that it is in good shape though with all the major problems properly fixed as She has had the car for 20 years and serviced at the same place for 20 years...good chance I'm wrong listening to stories

If not this Z, Ill look for another one. Keep that attitude I guess.

 

^ I in no way, am very knowledgeable about the Z32's. I personally own 4 280zx's (S130's). And I love these cars. But even they have killed my wallet. I have put quite a bit of cash in these cars. And I am still not done. And currently, not one of them run at all. But I wouldn't give them up for anything.

As others have already said on here. Be cautious, and take their advice. I didn't have a car until I was 18. Mainly because, I didn't have a job or a license yet. All aside, weigh out the possibilities. If you feel you can afford to keep it going. Then go for it. It wouldn't be a bad first car. And something to talk about, when you are older. All in all, good luck, with whatever you decide.

 

Should be going for the drive next week, maybe with T-tops off-another feature I like.

 

Everyone thats responded to you knows their **** pretty well, just from my experience with the board.

Theyre all right.

I dont know if i would specifically call the car a money pit, but if you cant do any of the work yourself, and im going to assume this is your first Z, youre gonna be sinking bank into it, especially one thats 20 years old.

Personally Ive had my 93 for the past 5-6 years and I havent sunk that much cash into it. Other then the 60k maintenance and dropping a new motor in, the only other major expenses Ive had were doing the exhaust, but that was all preference not a need.

But like I said if you can do the work yourself you will save. Expect stuff to start going, like injectors and water pump and other things especially if some of it hasnt been changed yet.

Also keep in mind that the cars only as good as its taken care of, and its few and far between that you can find a mechanic who knows enough about these cars to really work on them. Even dealerships dont know ****.

Good luck.

 

Yeah its going to be tough weighing out whether I should buy it or not, I really dont want to have all these expenses but it sounds like it's inevitable. Dad says he doesnt want a headache. We were actually discussing the car together and he said if it isnt in good shape and i still want to buy it he wont let me, because we both know he will be paying for most of maintenance-headache would be just buying car and paying insurance.

It seems like it's worth all the trouble though...

 

Speaking from first hand experience, I owned three z32's (2 N/A's 1 TT) in highschool and they WILL suck you dry if anything breaks and you don't have a decent paying job. I made the mistake of trying to save $50 by using an autozone timing belt kit and it ended up costing me $2300 for a new motor.

The moral of the story is, buy something cheap, that's cheap to fix and you can thrash on it, without worrying about breaking it. (z31's are great at it)

 

I'm surprised that nobody touched on the fact that the teacher must be pretty
rough on a car. Who trashes a leather interior (at least the seat) in 80K miles?

Worse yet, who goes through two clutches in UNDER 80,000 miles (the third
one must have been installed before that mark to fit the description)? Someone
who knows how to drive a manual transmission equipped car properly should be
able to get 100K out of a clutch; I usually replace mine at about 150K.

Who knows what else she was rough on that hasn't surfaced yet?

 

yep, going to break you. i wish i would have held off on buying a z until after college. it's seriously put a major damper on my life. though, i love it, and i have something to be proud of that none of my peers do.

 

Reliability? L-6, About a 7 out of 10. V6, about a 4...

Insurance? First the year matters most. My 86 Rx7 was about 46 a month. My 82 280, about 40. My brothers 06' RSX-S is about 1,200 every 6 months O.O . Second: NA, about an 9. Turbo? maybe a 6.5. Third, right hand drive or left hand drive? Coupes and Sedans arent frowned upon, Sports cars (Like the Z) matter.

Overall Long term performance: Variable. Depends on what was all actually done, how you drive it, how it was driven before (Your teacher may be the female version of Akio Asakura, you may never know...). Will you perform an oil change every x,xxx miles. Do you run 91 octane or 89? Tune ups, oil filter changes, fuel filter, fuel pump...

If you drive it and never change the oil or something that goes either unnoticed to the careless eye or bypassed by the unknowing, you'll find yourself here looking on how to change your gaskets =(

Just make sure you get you a manual (CHILTONS FTW). And when you're not at school or at your local haunt, you'd better be on here, learning on how to rebuild your car top to bottom =). The newer the car, the better you oughta know. Not trying to scare you, in all honesty I wish I could have a 90 300zed instead of my 280zx.

 

ok... well I am all ears but I stilll have the mindset of buying it.

Keeeping it Maintained looks like the killer, and since its the 1990 (Ive heard and read about the electrical issues, injectors and other stuff) it DOES seem like Id go through the same story.

So instead I would like to ask under what circumstances would you buy the car if you were in my situation-I can pay for insurance and Car itself but I wont be able to cover much of maintenance (cuz most of my money would be gone) which dad doesnt want at all.

if anyone could give me sugestions on what to look for that could give me an indication that it wont be too big of a headache in the future, things such as Major jobs done. For example, my list is to look for fuel injectors replaced (but Zlover says theyll go once a year so it wont matter much), Timing Belt replaced, water Pump, anythinhg else that should be added on?

Kathy & Rick also brought up a good point, Ill look into that too. -Doesnt living on a hill affect a clutch's lifetime?

 

Oh yeah, and the topic of alternatives... would you guys suggest to keep on looking for a Z(which is what Im going to do) or suggest an alternative vehicle.
My Alt. list is
-1996-2002 Nissan Maxima (manual)
-1996 Infiniti I30 (manual)-hard to find
-and maybe a beatup 1980's bmw 318t which my friend is selling for<500

 

The timing belt and water pump is a 60k maintenance thing, she should have records on something like that. Its a big job if you cant do it your self, expect at least a grand. The shop by me, who specializes in Z's will do it for like 1200.

You can do a ohm check on the injectors, its also a pricey job, just ask her for her records. But even if they were replaced, it doesnt mean theyre not going to fail on you.

I wouldnt say a hill would have that kind of effect on a clutch. I put 110k on mine before I changed it and ive never owned an automatic car. The clutch should last AT LEAST 100k unless she cant drive or just dumps it or rides it all the time. You should get the records on that or at least ask her why shes gone through two of them already.

My first z was an 86 z31 and I loved it. It was easier to work on, i personally liked the body style a lot, its a little quick, its a cool little sports car and I can guarantee you can find a turbo for under 2 grand.

Get paper work from her, the way I think about work, if theres no paper work, it wasnt done. Its like when people tell you the ac works it just needs to be recharged. It probably doesnt work. My favorite is "the body has 200k but the motor only has 60k" but you dont have any kind of paper work or proof of the swap? Come on now.

Check out the z31's theyre cool and decently priced.

 

Z31? Hmm.. None around here even on autotrader, Ill consider it though.

Paper Work-she says she has had everything done to the car on paper, good thing.

Ill upload a pic of the exterior, it's in pretty good shape with a few chips. Interior still to come, it's like a 4/5 out of 10.

After I see the papers Ill post what's done then ask what you guys think is a reasonable price. She said her husband wants 3500 and hes going off of KBB and in "fair condition" it's 3420 does that say something...

papers will tell