1982 Alignment Problems
11-09-2014, 05:34 PM
#1
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Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: South Bay Area, CA
Posts: 75
1982 Alignment Problems
Amazingly, the HBZ guys are stumped by this issue, even after a year of the thread being active. Now trying my luck here.
December 2013:
I've gotten my cars wheels aligned three times at the local shop. First time was for replacing steering rack bushings and struts (KYB), second time was for replacing the rest of the bushings and this most recent time after replacing the tires. I've gotten it back each time with the car pulling to the right. Holding the wheel rougly 15 degrees to the left keeps it straight. Any less, it wanders to the right. I've been using 205/70/R14 tires.
Image is from first alignment in Fall 2012
And a year later:
No idea how this changed so drastically. In my ownership, i've never spun out, hit a curb, or even a pothole...
Another thing to note: When i bought the car, a very loud, rapid, clunking/knocking noise could be heard from the rear left of the car when going up a hill, or even a slight grade above 40MPH under load. I initially thought this was caused by a combination of blown shocks, and a warped brake rotor. I replaced the shocks, and the sound went away for a while. It came back, so i replaced the rear rotors, and once again the sound went away for a while. Now, its back again.
It comes on slow, then gets louder and it repeats faster. The car also vibrates when this happens. Something has to be broken. Maybe whatever is causing this noise, is related to my alignment issues.
January 2014: The car has been taken to three shops. The entire suspension and rear drivetrain has been gone through but no one can find the problem. I also checked all of the wheel bearings, and they are fine.
October 2014: Issue continues, but i have discovered something. Look closely. See the fractures on the rotor? I'm pretty sure this has to do with the noise i'm hearing. I posted that on the 280ZX Drivers Facebook page, and the answers i am getting are a "Rattling Pad" Due to improper shimming or a dragging caliper (Both rears are rebuilt by P.O). Remember, i only hear the sound going over bumps, and under load uphill. I do remember the P.O telling me that rear rebuilt calipers were installed.
Today, Nov 9: Strange treadwear on front tires.
December 2013:
I've gotten my cars wheels aligned three times at the local shop. First time was for replacing steering rack bushings and struts (KYB), second time was for replacing the rest of the bushings and this most recent time after replacing the tires. I've gotten it back each time with the car pulling to the right. Holding the wheel rougly 15 degrees to the left keeps it straight. Any less, it wanders to the right. I've been using 205/70/R14 tires.
Image is from first alignment in Fall 2012
And a year later:
No idea how this changed so drastically. In my ownership, i've never spun out, hit a curb, or even a pothole...
Another thing to note: When i bought the car, a very loud, rapid, clunking/knocking noise could be heard from the rear left of the car when going up a hill, or even a slight grade above 40MPH under load. I initially thought this was caused by a combination of blown shocks, and a warped brake rotor. I replaced the shocks, and the sound went away for a while. It came back, so i replaced the rear rotors, and once again the sound went away for a while. Now, its back again.
It comes on slow, then gets louder and it repeats faster. The car also vibrates when this happens. Something has to be broken. Maybe whatever is causing this noise, is related to my alignment issues.
January 2014: The car has been taken to three shops. The entire suspension and rear drivetrain has been gone through but no one can find the problem. I also checked all of the wheel bearings, and they are fine.
October 2014: Issue continues, but i have discovered something. Look closely. See the fractures on the rotor? I'm pretty sure this has to do with the noise i'm hearing. I posted that on the 280ZX Drivers Facebook page, and the answers i am getting are a "Rattling Pad" Due to improper shimming or a dragging caliper (Both rears are rebuilt by P.O). Remember, i only hear the sound going over bumps, and under load uphill. I do remember the P.O telling me that rear rebuilt calipers were installed.
Today, Nov 9: Strange treadwear on front tires.
11-10-2014, 05:05 PM
#2
Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 1,103
I haven't seen anything like this before. I'm wondering if the rotors are showing the 'chatter' caused by air in the brake lines... but why is the chatter always in the same rhythm? I guess I would bleed the lines (takes 2 people to do it right), see if the problem stops -and, if not, start rebuilding brakes from scratch by switching out parts. New or used parts are OK for a rebuild, except new OEM pads are best if you can get 'em. Looks like rotor will need turning or replacement. But brakes gotta be good and working right! Time to git 'er done! 
PS: Your front tires say your front end has a real alignment issue. Been there, the adjust-ables just get adjusted over the years beyond their range and won't adjust any more. Gotta replace 'em then or your tires wear out weird - and aren't gripping the road right either.
PS: Your front tires say your front end has a real alignment issue. Been there, the adjust-ables just get adjusted over the years beyond their range and won't adjust any more. Gotta replace 'em then or your tires wear out weird - and aren't gripping the road right either.
Last edited by zxguy1986; 11-10-2014 at 05:15 PM.
11-19-2014, 03:52 PM
#3
Registered User
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: South Bay Area, CA
Posts: 75
I haven't seen anything like this before. I'm wondering if the rotors are showing the 'chatter' caused by air in the brake lines... but why is the chatter always in the same rhythm? I guess I would bleed the lines (takes 2 people to do it right), see if the problem stops -and, if not, start rebuilding brakes from scratch by switching out parts. New or used parts are OK for a rebuild, except new OEM pads are best if you can get 'em. Looks like rotor will need turning or replacement. But brakes gotta be good and working right! Time to git 'er done!
PS: Your front tires say your front end has a real alignment issue. Been there, the adjust-ables just get adjusted over the years beyond their range and won't adjust any more. Gotta replace 'em then or your tires wear out weird - and aren't gripping the road right either.
PS: Your front tires say your front end has a real alignment issue. Been there, the adjust-ables just get adjusted over the years beyond their range and won't adjust any more. Gotta replace 'em then or your tires wear out weird - and aren't gripping the road right either.
11-19-2014, 06:51 PM
#4
Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 1,103
I think that's right. Anyway, alignment for older cars was always about the big three: camber, caster and toe. There is a fourth one now - forget what they called it - for new cars, but older cars can't be adjusted for that anyway so I guess it doesn't matter here.
I have been suspicious of those printouts from the alignment places since two places gave completely different readings for the same front end on the same day. Same tire retailer, too. One guy admitted his equipment was "off the mark" and was scheduled to be repaired, so he sent me to the other shop. They told me I needed new tie rods because the old ones were beyond further adjustment. It took a third place (different retailer) to make the 'right adjustments' and the road chatter went away. Car seemed OK on the road at higher speeds - but the tires didn't wear right after that. Like your tire wear photo above, they wore the tread on the 'outside' more than the 'inside.'
For your Z, I'm guessing the OEM parts are no longer available - so it comes down to finding the right aftermarket stuff and getting it installed correctly. Then finding the right alignment place to check it out. When computers are in charge of coming up with the final numbers, the GIGO principle comes into play: Garbage in, garbage out. If the company has wrong numbers in their database, nobody's car gets a fair reading compared to those numbers.
I have been suspicious of those printouts from the alignment places since two places gave completely different readings for the same front end on the same day. Same tire retailer, too. One guy admitted his equipment was "off the mark" and was scheduled to be repaired, so he sent me to the other shop. They told me I needed new tie rods because the old ones were beyond further adjustment. It took a third place (different retailer) to make the 'right adjustments' and the road chatter went away. Car seemed OK on the road at higher speeds - but the tires didn't wear right after that. Like your tire wear photo above, they wore the tread on the 'outside' more than the 'inside.'
For your Z, I'm guessing the OEM parts are no longer available - so it comes down to finding the right aftermarket stuff and getting it installed correctly. Then finding the right alignment place to check it out. When computers are in charge of coming up with the final numbers, the GIGO principle comes into play: Garbage in, garbage out. If the company has wrong numbers in their database, nobody's car gets a fair reading compared to those numbers.
Last edited by zxguy1986; 11-19-2014 at 06:59 PM.
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