Moffer

So the new C6 Z06 Corvette can beat a lamborghini Gallardo with its LS7 V8. It does the 1/4 mile in 11's... The corvette weighs 3100 pounds. Now how about that same LS7 in a Z? It would weigh what...? 2700 pounds...? I'd like to see what people would think of that and guesses as to what the 1/4 mile and 0-60 would be. No saying it cant be done, tho, cause with enough $$ anything can be done.

NismoPick

Does the LS7 have the same motor mount locations as the LS1 & 2?

Moffer

I dont really thnk so. I believe its a 427ci and not a 350. So im sure the mounts would all have to be custom.

emo236

don't quote me, but I think it's actually just a bored and stroked LS1...giving it more cubic inch.

Moffer

If thats true it would be nice cause they got plenty of aftermarket mounts for the LS1 in that huge engine bay. It would be nice to have a 505hp+ 240, 260, or 280!

RodMoyes

Yeah, I guess that would be all well and good for a 1/4 mile car... But it ceases being a "Lambo Killer" as soon as you get to the first turn... ... ... ... Rod.

emo236

ACtually, that's incorrect. IF one was to go the mile to swap in an LS7, it's safe to assume that they would have extensive suspension mods. Along with that, the LS1 swap is actually placed farther back giving a near 50\50 weight distr. Many have experienced little to no weight gain.

RodMoyes

Actually, it IS correct. The S30 or even the S130 are too narrow and just don't have the wheel base or mass or structural rigidity to handle like a Lamborghini. I don't car how much money you spend... It's pretty difficult to get around the hard laws of physics. In order to do it, there would be so much fabrication and re-engineering that you would be left with a car that is a Z from outward appearances only. The entirety of the car below the skin would be new. I wasn't talking about weight gain or even distrubution. That platform is just simply not capable of both the power and speeds associated with "Lambo" type numbers. To make it so would mean to completly change the sub-structure of the car, making it anything other than a Z. ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... Rod.

emo236

tell that to the SCCA drivers.

jmmorriso

One thing that I have learned, is that Rod is right, no matter what And, I dont think your average pasta rocket driver is going to have the cahones to drive it in deep like a Z guy, hes gonna be too worried about rock chips, and spilling his brandy or whatever rich guys with no taste do. Yeah, its almost gross how much my s130 twists, I hung a new front end on it about 6mos ago, and after a little spirited street driving my perfect fender gaps are far from perfect. Ive heard of guys cracking headlight buckets by the hood because the body tweaks so much in the turns. If I had unlimited resources, Id gut my interior again, cut the floor rails and roof off and do a real hardcore cage to eliminate the twisting. Why cut up a perfectly good z06 when you could just have a perfectly good z06? All these crazy motor swaps are starting to worry me. I just read about a guy with an opel GT thats doing a BBC swap! What the hell for! the stock motor barely fit in those things and hes gonna pig a bigblock into it. It seems for what some of these projects cost, and the performance gain you get, you might as well just take the donor cars to a good body shop and have them repaired. But thats just me and Im an ******* and everyone knows it Incidentally, I am also a collision repair tech, so maybe that explains some of it too.

RodMoyes

So then are you comparing something like the Bob Sharp SCCA car to a stock 280ZX????????????????????????????????? The only things they share in common are the block and overall appearance. They are tubular framed monsters with insane suspension and engine upgrades. They are also not "streetable" in any way, shape or form. A Stock Diablo VT, Gallardo, or Murcielago are street legal stock cars that can smoke even the Famous Bob Sharp Cars from the 80's on just about any track on any day and do it in stock form on pump gas. I was simply saying that aside from completely gutting and changong the original platform into something so vastly different from the stock mass production car, you weren't ever going to have a "Lambo Killer". I love my Z cars, but I am not now nor have I ever been diluted into thinking that it's a "SuperCar" in disguise. My Porsche 930S is in fact a "SuperCar" and I can't imagine the insane amount of time, money and craftsmanship would have to go into my 280ZX to make it even compete with tha car. If I could get it to that point, it would be a very different machine and as I stated before... Would no longer really be a Z with the exception of its outward appearance. I was trying to be a dick, but let's be serious here. Like JM wrote in his statement, the Z platform in question just can't handle that much power without twisting itself apart. If you want a 1/4 mile car, it's all good. If you want a road course racer that can keep up with the ultimate spaghetti burners then starting with the S30 or S130 platform is like trying to turn Phyllis Diller into Kate Moss.... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... Rod.

jmmorriso

Thankyou Rod. for what it would cost to make a s130 as good all around as your 930s you might as well bite the bullet, walk into the Porsche dealer, pay the six figures for a new one and just have the darn Porsche! Or do what I, and probably most of us here would do and buy a beat up old 930 for like 30k and spend another 30k getting it right! Sometimes I think my life would be simpler if I wasn't fairly good with cars, had gone to college, and had some desk job somewhere. But then I wouldnt have a bottomless pit to dump all of my money into, and what fun is that!

Lost Vegaz

Just a question, just trying to get a serious discusion, with no B.S..

But what about adding serious bracing every where there is flex. Triangles don't flex. And made with tubes, don't weigh to much. So if you add alot of triangles, like welded to the bottom of the car, kinda like a ladder bar, but welded right to the floor. and weld small ones to the door openings. I know that they beef these areas up when they make convertibles. Just enough so it does not hinder you getting in or out. Like maybe just a couple inches, and add more cross bracing, and to the shock towers to the firewall?? And add a good roll bar with rear bracing to aid in the hatch area??

Wouldn't that add serious rigidy?? I honestly don't know much about this stuff, so let's start a discussion. And please try to keep the B.S. out. I am curious about this, and maybe others are too. So those that know share what you know

emo236

Got some numbers to prove your rant? You made some claims there that are not backed up....I'd like to see numbers in order to give your statement any validity.

RodMoyes

Dude, Switch to decaf. Rant???? What Rant? I was simply stating facts. What "Numbers" do you want? Seriously... What numbers? 0-60? Lateral G's? Braking distances? (Something else that would have to be greatly modified that we haven't even discussed) What in the world do you mean? One thing also to mention is that the new Z06 was designed from the ground up not only to handle that motor but to be lightweight and responsive at the same time. It weighs 3138 Lbs. Once you add enough bracing to the S30 or S130 chassis to equal the Z06's chassis stregnth, I'd be willing to bet that it's going to weigh MORE than the Z06 does... Suddenly that kinda diminishes the expected wild performance figures. That is assuming that you do it in a way that keeps the car in somewhat "Stock" appearance inside and out. I'm talking FULL interior and creature comforts JUST LIKE THE STOCK Z06 has from the factory. My whole initial point was not to say that it wouldn't make a 1/4 monster if you put that motor in a Z... It would. It would be like a rocket. But to make it a well balanced track racer that is streetable at the same time... No way. My whole point was that the term "Lambo Killer" was a misnomer at best. It may be a 1/4 mile screamer, but that's not any Lambo's purpose. Lambo's are quick, fast and nimble exotic sports cars that are fully capable on the track or on the road. They don't have stripped interiors and visible roll cages like an SCCA car now do they? I didn't bring up the whole SCCA thing either by the way. Comparing any stock production car to an SCCA racer is ludicrous... That was my point. I didn't post here to be a dick or to start an argument. I was simply pointing out the fact that it would take far more than an LS7 motor to make an old Z car a "Lambo Killer" that's it... Nothing more, nothing less. You ask for numbers that mean squat in this debate. They are pointless for trying to make sense of the question at hand. That question is.... Would an LS7 motor swapped S30 or S130 be able to out drive a modern Lamborghini in any way other than straight line acceleration? The answer is: No, plain and simple. Fast acceleration does not a complete car make... Too bad you had to go all sideways over it.

Moffer

The reason you would make an underdog car in the supercar world like a Z just as fast as supercars is for fun, not for any validity to anyone else but urself. We all know its not so much the car u drive but how much you spent is the deciding factor in how fast it is. Granted some cars are better set up for performance than others, But put enough money into anything and its performace numbers can get up there considerably. Truth is the lambo can be beaten by a Z on a track with the exception of what Rod said: a total make-over underneath. But it is POSSIBLE. Why do this? Cause you can... what other excuse you need?

jmmorriso

Well, as for strenghtening the zx any considerable amount, it's still going to take serious work. A rolllcage that ties into the rear xmember, the front xmember, and of course the strut towers. you would probably have to kiss the dash goodbye, although without the side vents and some of the electronic junk you might be able to get the downtubes and the front bar by the cowl in there. If its doable, that would be way cool. the main weakpoint is the front strut towers I think, maybe someone with some real experience can back me up, but ther are so high up in the air and so far from the unibody rails. they need to be tied together, and tied to the main strucure of the cage (cowl bar) to prevent as much relative movement as possible. Ooh! dont forget to have the car on a perfectly flat surface and no weight on the suspension and the structure of the car perfectly true to the floor. Having the car checked out on a frame rack by a really good tech first might not be a bad idea either. I doubt there are very many perfect Z unibodies out there.

jerkk

you would probly get about a mid to high 9 out of the ls7. but the car would not have the caracture it would have doing it whith its own motor. plus you could sell the ls7 to a old school hot rodder for enough to make the stock motor do it its self.

jerkk

you would probly get about a mid to high 9 out of the ls7. but the car would not have the caracture it would have doing it whith its own motor. plus you could sell the ls7 to a old school hot rodder for enough to make the stock motor do it its self.

Lost Vegaz

The bars that tie into the strut towers can tie into the fire wall and run behind the stock dash. It is a pain in the a$$, but it can be done. Roll cages n race cars don't need to be hidden or done for easy entry or exit. But they can be done with more thought and still stiffen the chassis. I think it would still stiffen the chassis and make the car handle better

Moffer

Like i said. The reason to do crazy stuff like an LS7 swap is for $hits and giggles. It would be pretty fun to say you have a C6 Z06 engine under your 1973 hood.

ZETA

Hi,

I have a 280Z prokect going on,It will have the LS2 engine out a 2005 GTO with some upgrades,I think i should be close to the 500 h.p.,I willl add a magna charger or a turbo in a near future.I will do the body reinforcement after I boost the engine.I won't need it before.
I have been in a LS1 280Z and it feels great.(this car has no reinforcements and it drives great)

Here is a link to my page!

http://www.cardomain.com/id/77zeta

Archilight_Z

OK sorry I didn't read through all the bullshit rants, but here is some information on the LS6/LS7 engines, they are gen III chevy small blocks which means they are completely different fron any other small block like them. the oil filter location is different, the motor mounts locations are different, oil pump, ect. anyone who is considering putting one in their Z needs to do some research first. The generation III small block is all aluminum block and heads AKA it is very light even lighter then a L series engine. as far as putting an LS7 in a Z? how are you going to hook up? the corvette or gallardo will always be faster because of two words, traction control. when you get to that much horsepower in such a light car, it stops being an option for extremely fast takeoffs. unless of course you plan to make your car not handle by throwing on some wide slicks in the rear. as far as out handling a gallardo in all aspects? even with the LS7, the problem are 1. gallardo has all wheel drive and most importantly, 2. it has a modern suspension that was designed to handle 500 horsepower. the Z does not, while the datsun Z cars are miraculous in their handling ability, they just cannot compete with a modern day sports car that had multi hundreds of horsepower in the design concept. If you still don't understand, it is simple, lets take a 500 horsepower datsun Z car vs a gallardo, the z car driver will go into the turn and then has to be very careful not to spin the tires after the apex while as the (suspension designed with 500 hp in mind) AWD gallardo will be able to put more throttle after the apex safely. thereby eventually leading to the passing of the Z car. I am not against seeing a LS7 small block in a datsun, just be aware of what the car will be capable of.

jfairladyz

Well maybe next time you really should read through all the bullshit rants cause everything, and I mean EVERYTHING you just wasted your time typing has already been posted in this thread. A few times.

NismoPick

I'm gunna go on a hunch here... sounds like Archie is a 17 year old boy that recently discovered "Sport Compact" and "Lowrider" magazines.

Yes Archie... next time you SHOULD READ THE ENTIRE THREAD BEFORE POSTING YOUR RANT... you might look more educated.